[poll] So you have a familiar, which one?
- Thread starter Frostmarrow
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green slime
First Post
I'd save myself until I had the Improved Familiar feat, or, given that I might not have the feats available, I'd choose Raven.
Its a style statement.
Its a style statement.
Mine is a toad!
My elven wizard is stuck with a lousy Con, plus the racial penalty. The toad was, literally, do or die.
So she has a very pretty toad, white with purple markings, and is kept in a carefully crafted silver cage.
My druid, on the other hand has a big-ass bear and a small viper as her pets.
My elven wizard is stuck with a lousy Con, plus the racial penalty. The toad was, literally, do or die.
So she has a very pretty toad, white with purple markings, and is kept in a carefully crafted silver cage.
My druid, on the other hand has a big-ass bear and a small viper as her pets.
Lord Pendragon
First Post
Okay, I just want to preface this by saying that I am truly content with my hawk familiar. Also, if this discussion annoys others, I'll stop. I don't want to break the thread. 
That said, I like to talk about familiars as a mental exercise.
This is very true. However, the owl shares this bonus (admittedly at night vs. the hawk's daylight bonus, but one could argue the merits of each circumstance equally, I think.) And an owl gives a +2 bonus to Move Silently as well. So with regards to the Spot check, the hawk is better than a raven, but on par with the owl, which also grants a +2 to a skill.
While this may be true, as you yourself said, roleplaying circumstances can never be used as a balance to game mechanics. So saying the hawk is more accepted, and thus should not get a bonus, doesn't work out.
Now I'm not saying that a hawk should grant a bonus to a stat like the toad. Obviously, the hawk is more convenient than the toad. Like the raven and owl, it is great as a scout, and can (if the wizard is willing to risk it,) deliver touch attacks much more easily as well.
However, when compared to the raven and owl, the hawk comes up short. An owl has low-light vision and a great listen check, and grants its master +2 to Move Silently. A raven speaks a language, enabling it to act in any number of tactical situations. The hawk...can fly. That's pretty much it.
Still...a hawk is cool. Just not the best choice from a powergamer's perspective. It scores well because it's a flyer, but scores last among the other flyers.
That said, I like to talk about familiars as a mental exercise.Madfox said:
This is very true. However, the owl shares this bonus (admittedly at night vs. the hawk's daylight bonus, but one could argue the merits of each circumstance equally, I think.) And an owl gives a +2 bonus to Move Silently as well. So with regards to the Spot check, the hawk is better than a raven, but on par with the owl, which also grants a +2 to a skill.
While this may be true, as you yourself said, roleplaying circumstances can never be used as a balance to game mechanics. So saying the hawk is more accepted, and thus should not get a bonus, doesn't work out.
Now I'm not saying that a hawk should grant a bonus to a stat like the toad. Obviously, the hawk is more convenient than the toad. Like the raven and owl, it is great as a scout, and can (if the wizard is willing to risk it,) deliver touch attacks much more easily as well.
However, when compared to the raven and owl, the hawk comes up short. An owl has low-light vision and a great listen check, and grants its master +2 to Move Silently. A raven speaks a language, enabling it to act in any number of tactical situations. The hawk...can fly. That's pretty much it.
Still...a hawk is cool. Just not the best choice from a powergamer's perspective. It scores well because it's a flyer, but scores last among the other flyers.
Frostmarrow
First Post
Lord Pendragon said:Okay, I just want to preface this by saying that I am truly content with my hawk familiar. Also, if this discussion annoys others, I'll stop. I don't want to break the thread.
While this may be true, as you yourself said, roleplaying circumstances can never be used as a balance to game mechanics. So saying the hawk is more accepted, and thus should not get a bonus, doesn't work out.
Now I'm not saying that a hawk should grant a bonus to a stat like the toad. Obviously, the hawk is more convenient than the toad. Like the raven and owl, it is great as a scout, and can (if the wizard is willing to risk it,) deliver touch attacks much more easily as well.
However, when compared to the raven and owl, the hawk comes up short. An owl has low-light vision and a great listen check, and grants its master +2 to Move Silently. A raven speaks a language, enabling it to act in any number of tactical situations. The hawk...can fly. That's pretty much it.
Still...a hawk is cool. Just not the best choice from a powergamer's perspective. It scores well because it's a flyer, but scores last among the other flyers.
You are certainly right about that, Lord Pendragon. I think it's designed that way on purpose so to speak. The hawk is the coolest choice but is supposed to be quite rare so it's less powerful. Toads are plentiful and should be more common therefore it grants a hefty bonus.
By picking hawk you show that you care more for style than stats. If you are a half-elf with a hawk you are really cool. Elves with toads are silly. It screams munchkin. I think it's pretty funny actually. It's sort of like the half-orc and it's strength bonus. -You want to be strong, heh? Well, then you won't mind being ugly. -You want to be tough, heh? Well, then you can carry around a stinking frog in your pantaloons. I don't want to come off as too patronizing because there can be a really good reason (except for the con bouns) to pick a toad role-playing wise. So no offense, ok?
By the way, in modern day a toad would not be a good choice since toads and frogs are on the brink of extinction in real life and hard to come by. This is indeed sad. What's even more sad is that the scientists have no idea why frogs all around the world asre dying by the bucket loads.
Rashak Mani
First Post
Dam I was going to post this poll... got too late
Well as for the Hawk vs Owl thing... I prefer the Owl... during the day I let my Owl sleep a while and then he stays awake at night when I am sleeping and sleeps a little during my turn of the watch. Therefore I am always alerted immediately if anything happens at night.
Also during the day the chances of ambush and sneaking thieves is less than during the day. The owl can still due the day reconaissance as well.
Invisible opponents are that much easier to locate and blast with the +14 listen of the Owl... +14 move silently hep Owl survive scouting.
Combat wise the Hawk is better (NOTE ERRATA FOR OWL makes it attack damage basically sh*t) Combat with familiars is a good way to lose a familiar and not much else...
Roleplaying wise I agree with the idea that a Hawk will not be associated with Witches and Mages... but that is an in game consideration. Even in cities I take my Owl along... she just flies overhead so as not to call too much attention. At the Inn I open the window for the owl to come in.... no problems at all. 1 mile communication is very good.
As for TOADS !! They are pathetically useless !! Rather have a super scouting familiar ! Not getting ambushed is far more healthy than having more HPs (1 p/lvl !) to lose in the ambush.
Well as for the Hawk vs Owl thing... I prefer the Owl... during the day I let my Owl sleep a while and then he stays awake at night when I am sleeping and sleeps a little during my turn of the watch. Therefore I am always alerted immediately if anything happens at night.
Also during the day the chances of ambush and sneaking thieves is less than during the day. The owl can still due the day reconaissance as well.
Invisible opponents are that much easier to locate and blast with the +14 listen of the Owl... +14 move silently hep Owl survive scouting.
Combat wise the Hawk is better (NOTE ERRATA FOR OWL makes it attack damage basically sh*t) Combat with familiars is a good way to lose a familiar and not much else...
Roleplaying wise I agree with the idea that a Hawk will not be associated with Witches and Mages... but that is an in game consideration. Even in cities I take my Owl along... she just flies overhead so as not to call too much attention. At the Inn I open the window for the owl to come in.... no problems at all. 1 mile communication is very good.
As for TOADS !! They are pathetically useless !! Rather have a super scouting familiar ! Not getting ambushed is far more healthy than having more HPs (1 p/lvl !) to lose in the ambush.
Frostmarrow said:
Too late.
Hey, frogs and toads are CUTE! And the jungle varieties are downright deadly. That count's as cool in my book.
@whee! I believe this is the first time I've ever been a munchkin. We're currently playing a hack game - why shouldn't I take something that will help my character? Just because something starts out as a choice derived strictly to gain a bonus doesn't mean that it can't become a major character identifier, ya know.
Ashtal
Last edited:
Frostmarrow
First Post
Ashtal said:
Too late.
Hey, frogs and toads are CUTE! And the jungle varieties are downright deadly. That count's as cool in my book.
@whee! I believe this is the first time I've ever been a munchkin. We're currently playing a hack game - why shouldn't I take something that will help my character? Just because something starts out as a choice derived strictly to gain a bonus doesn't mean that it can't become a major character identifier, ya know.
Ashtal
Ashtal, whether you are a munchkin is not settled yet. You might be from just looking at your choice of pet, however, we need to learn more about your role-playing skills before we can decide on the final verdict.
Actually I don't believe in munchkinism. It's your duty to make as good a character as you can, frogs or no frogs.
Frogs are not cute. They are slimy and filthy and they die in your hand. (Speaking from own experience, I tried to liberate a frog from a pond as a kid. It died on the bus.)
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