D&D 5E Polymorph and Mental Ability Scores

[Mallus]

And if you read it in a too generously way you are also doing it wrong.

Yeah, absolutely.

The trick is to find the sweet spot between "I would never use this" and "Why would I use anything else?".

edit: though, in my experiences, overly-generous is more fun than overly-restrictive. Overly-generous makes the game easier, overly-restrictive makes the game frustrating, and tends to discourage creative thinking in favor of using the simplest, RAW solution and/or the most direct, combat-centered approach.

 

[I'm A Banana]

Here's a handy rule of thumb for parsing spell descriptions (or any rules text, really).

If your reading of the spell makes it useless, you are reading it wrong.

i.e., use the reduction of mental stats as a source of comic relief/characterization tool, don't remove most of the spell's utility. Parsing a spell into uselessness is waste of effort. If you don't like it, ban/remove it.

If you keep the mental stats as a significant limiting factor, you don't make the spell useless. It's still very useful to, say, turn beholders into guinea pigs or to turn the enemy leader into a T-rex who thinks his cavalry looks delicious or to turn a powerful brute monster into a horse you can ride for a quick getaway. And in a pinch you can still turn into a gorilla for extra HP, or do the "expensive feather fall" thing and turn into a whale in midair to survive terminal velocity falls, or whatever.

But you'll have to leave the "turn into a bird and scout" thing to the party druid, most of the time.

I my experiences, overly-generous is more fun than overly-restrictive.

I don't really agree. While it's harmless much of the time, over-generosity can lead to making my character feel less special, my contributions feel more token, and my gameplay experience to be overall emptier and less interesting. Being over-generous can be just as destructive and unpleasant as being overly-restrictive, just in a different way.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

I usually don't restrict too much. Instead I try to make rule as fun rulings and also trying to interpret rules thta it makes as much sense as possible. In the polymorph case I would rule that since you retain your personality you know who you are and who your enemies are. You also remember what you were about to do and you are able to remember most things. Otherwise the level 10 transmuter ability would be useless and make no sense. I would however rule, that noticing fine details may call for an investigation check. Not to see what is there but to draw conclusions why it is there. So as a hawk you may see some people on the streets but you won't notice that they are heading to the same place the last few people went to and they are all wearing similar clothes.

(yes it is really hard to notice such things if you don't pay attention although you can clearly notice those details when they are presented all at once.

 

[Caliban]

So if you are a wizard and cast the spell to polymorph into a bird, to do some location scouting, it's kind of useless as written.
You effectively transfom into an Int 2 bird, and even though you can stay focused on the task at hand, I doubt you'll remember much when you get back to your normal form.
If you can remember that you were once human, or how the spell actually works beforehand

Do you have any advice on how to rule this problem ?

Introduce them to the "Find Familiar" spell?

 

[discosoc]

I'd say a Wizard using polymorph for the purpose of scouting an area as a bird is probably not that far from INT 2 anyway.

 

[Illithidbix]

edit: though, in my experiences, overly-generous is more fun than overly-restrictive. Overly-generous makes the game easier, overly-restrictive makes the game frustrating, and tends to discourage creative thinking in favor of using the simplest, RAW solution and/or the most direct, combat-centered approach.

I normally agree with this maxim, but it seems to differ with the fundamental *intent* of these spells, or at least how I read them.

I very much took Polymorph as a *bad thing*, True Polymorph as a *good thing*


Polymorph is a 4th level spell and is basically turning your enemies into bad things
Circe (no, not that one) turning Odysseus' crew into pigs.

It might also have useful applications on casting on a friend (turn them into a Trex and run away as they do a heroic last stomp.)



True Polymoph and Shapechange are 9th level spells that are designed for
MAHAHA! And now you face my FINAL FORM! Moments.

Merlin vs Madam Mim from Disney's Sword in the Stone
Or Jaffar turning into a giant snake in Aladdin


… And yes I just use two Disney references and one classical one… #cultured.

 

[Unwise]

...or do the "expensive feather fall" thing and turn into a whale in midair to survive terminal velocity falls, or whatever.

Haha, umm, turning into a whale is definitely not the first thing that come to mind if I am falling off a cliff. You had me wondering for a moment if a whale would do anything but turn into an oily puddle if dropped from a plane.

I can just see the party waiting at the bottom of the cliff, looking up and seeing the druid fall, "don't worry he can shapeshift into a....?....? whale!?" SPLAT! Blubber, blood, oil and horror cover the entire scene. The bards, dying breath as he is crushed under a tonne of whale soup "a biiiird, why not a biiiiirrd? blaaargh"

 

[I'm A Banana]

Haha, umm, turning into a whale is definitely not the first thing that come to mind if I am falling off a cliff. You had me wondering for a moment if a whale would do anything but turn into an oily puddle if dropped from a plane.

Hehehe, it wouldn't be my first choice either, but I had a gnome wild mage with the polymorph spell who was soaring through the air on dragonback and had cause to think of what might happen if he was...forcefully unseated.

 

[Sunseeker]

No spell is worth its weight in words if the intent of the spell is not considered as well as knowledge of the world.

So if in Bobworld regular polymorph does exactly as it says, the Joe the Wizard wouldn't cast it on himself because he's lose his mind.

But in in Joesworld polymorph lets the caster retain his smarts, then Bob the wizard would reasonably know this before using it on himself or others.

 

[Ovinomancer]

I normally agree with this maxim, but it seems to differ with the fundamental *intent* of these spells, or at least how I read them.

I very much took Polymorph as a *bad thing*, True Polymorph as a *good thing*


Polymorph is a 4th level spell and is basically turning your enemies into bad things
Circe (no, not that one) turning Odysseus' crew into pigs.

It might also have useful applications on casting on a friend (turn them into a Trex and run away as they do a heroic last stomp.)



True Polymoph and Shapechange are 9th level spells that are designed for
MAHAHA! And now you face my FINAL FORM! Moments.

Merlin vs Madam Mim from Disney's Sword in the Stone
Or Jaffar turning into a giant snake in Aladdin


… And yes I just use two Disney references and one classical one… #cultured.

Um, doesn't True Polymorph still replace your mental stats? Shapechange, you're gold, but TP does the same thing as Polymorph without the 'beast only' restriction.