Polymorph - Gone?!?

[ONINOTAKI18]

I am starting to think that WOTC should have released a DMG, MM and a Heroic Tier PHB, Paragon Tier PHB, & Epic Tier PHB.

 

[small pumpkin man]

So night hags have no means to alter their appearance, in 4e?

The "change self" monster ability is still in (you can even get it as a PC if you play a changeling), and Wizards still get disguise self. It's the openended buff uses of shapechanging abilities which have were the problem in 3.x, not the disguise uses.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

I am starting to think that WOTC should have released a DMG, MM and a Heroic Tier PHB, Paragon Tier PHB, & Epic Tier PHB.

I'm confident they'll offer those as supplements before too long.

 

[Otterscrubber]

Yup. All gone, from what I've seen through folks.

Blessedly so, Polymorph was incredibly broken.

Agreed, i played a sorcerer in 3.5 who made great use of polymorph and eventually shapechange. Probably too much use. Anything you use that often is a good sign that it is broken. I'm sure there will be some rituals that allow changing of forms but it should be a very special occurrence when someone actually becomes another type of being.

 

[Obryn]

Oh, thank goodness.

It needed completely revamped. Polymorph was not just broken, it was actively and intensely difficult to implement in-play.

The degree of number-crunching necessary for its use was insane.

-O

 

[Amphimir Míriel]

Its kinda wierd that the problems with open-ended polymorph were obvious since 1963

Merlin: Now Mi-Mim, n-no dragons, remember?
Madame Mim: Did I say no purple dragons? Did I??

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0057546/quotes

 

[mattdm]

If the magic items were moved back to the DMG where they belong, there would have been more room. Now magic items feel like shopping in a catalog along with bedrolls, rations, and 10' poles, rather than the mysterious objects the GM doles out to a lucky adventurer.

Artifacts are still in the DMG, and they definitely give the mysterious aura you're looking for. If you're wanting all magic items to be that way, D&D really hasn't been the game for you for, I dunno, 25 years at least.

The particularly great thing about this reorganization is that with 3E, players were really pushed to have not just the PHB but the DMG for magic items and the MM if they could shift shape or summon monsters. (Druids spent more of their time in that book than the one nominally for players.)

 

[Saeviomagy]

Its kinda wierd that the problems with open-ended polymorph were obvious since 1963

Well, IIRC, polymorph self originally did this wierd thing where it was appearance only, which led to my fremlin mage being unable to hold a door shut against a goblin when he was an ogre...

Polymorph other did the whole kit and kaboodle, but also changed the targets mind to match the new form. Which frankly was awesome when you turned all the demons of hell into lawful-good gold dragons...

 

[mrrodgers]

Well, IIRC, polymorph self originally did this wierd thing where it was appearance only, which led to my fremlin mage being unable to hold a door shut against a goblin when he was an ogre...

Polymorph other did the whole kit and kaboodle, but also changed the targets mind to match the new form. Which frankly was awesome when you turned all the demons of hell into lawful-good gold dragons...

but demons didn't live in hell, they lived in the abyss.

 

[Surgoshan]

I gather that summoning is also much restricted. There goes my two favorite character types. :/ It's not about brokenness -- it's about AWESOMENESS.

Polymorph and summoning are awesome because they're broken. Yes, a significant portion of the fun is in the fluff, that your PC is able to turn into a troll, or a frost giant, or maybe even just a bear. But the major portion of the fun is that, because of that change, you're able to win the fight, and winning is fun.