A reasonable stance. I was pretty tired when I wrote this out, and am actually surprised I remembered to add the "possibly a bad idea" part.
D&D 5E Possibly a bad idea, but what do you all think?
- Thread starter Lanliss
- Start date
A reasonable stance. I was pretty tired when I wrote this out, and am actually surprised I remembered to add the "possibly a bad idea" part.
pming
Legend
Hiya!
Lanliss...you're an Old Grognard like me, aren't you? Remember back in 1e or Basic days? Getting XP for killing was 'minor' and getting XP for recovery of treasure was 'major'. Then tack on some of the optional stuff found here and there in Dragon mag, or on a BBS or FTP site (remember those?) for things like finishing some particular goal, or finishing the module. Go back to that way.
This is one of my preferred methods. It rewards "play style"; from players who like to go in guns-a-blazin', killing everything that moves, to players who like to take a measured mix of combat, stealth, and diplomacy, to players who like to avoid combat if at all possible and *just* use stealth/role-playing. By giving XP for GP (whatever ratio you decide; I use 1:1, but I'm kind of a stingy DM..."miserly", even...), the players method matters most.
Does it make sense that a fighter gets better swinging a sword if they get all stealthy? Nope...but so what? It's a game, after all, and as long as the DM explains the reasoning behind the 'leveling' method (honestly, gaining 'levels' doesn't make much sense to begin with), most players can see, understand and accept (if not grow to prefer) the "XP for GP" method of ye olden days.
^_^
Paul L. Ming
Lanliss...you're an Old Grognard like me, aren't you? Remember back in 1e or Basic days? Getting XP for killing was 'minor' and getting XP for recovery of treasure was 'major'. Then tack on some of the optional stuff found here and there in Dragon mag, or on a BBS or FTP site (remember those?) for things like finishing some particular goal, or finishing the module. Go back to that way.
This is one of my preferred methods. It rewards "play style"; from players who like to go in guns-a-blazin', killing everything that moves, to players who like to take a measured mix of combat, stealth, and diplomacy, to players who like to avoid combat if at all possible and *just* use stealth/role-playing. By giving XP for GP (whatever ratio you decide; I use 1:1, but I'm kind of a stingy DM..."miserly", even...), the players method matters most.
Does it make sense that a fighter gets better swinging a sword if they get all stealthy? Nope...but so what? It's a game, after all, and as long as the DM explains the reasoning behind the 'leveling' method (honestly, gaining 'levels' doesn't make much sense to begin with), most players can see, understand and accept (if not grow to prefer) the "XP for GP" method of ye olden days.
^_^
Paul L. Ming
Hiya!
Lanliss...you're an Old Grognard like me, aren't you? Remember back in 1e or Basic days? Getting XP for killing was 'minor' and getting XP for recovery of treasure was 'major'. Then tack on some of the optional stuff found here and there in Dragon mag, or on a BBS or FTP site (remember those?) for things like finishing some particular goal, or finishing the module. Go back to that way.
This is one of my preferred methods. It rewards "play style"; from players who like to go in guns-a-blazin', killing everything that moves, to players who like to take a measured mix of combat, stealth, and diplomacy, to players who like to avoid combat if at all possible and *just* use stealth/role-playing. By giving XP for GP (whatever ratio you decide; I use 1:1, but I'm kind of a stingy DM..."miserly", even...), the players method matters most.
Does it make sense that a fighter gets better swinging a sword if they get all stealthy? Nope...but so what? It's a game, after all, and as long as the DM explains the reasoning behind the 'leveling' method (honestly, gaining 'levels' doesn't make much sense to begin with), most players can see, understand and accept (if not grow to prefer) the "XP for GP" method of ye olden days.
^_^
Paul L. Ming
Do I seem like a grognard? 5E is just about my first TTRPG experience ever, aside from a couple of PF games I ran out of the starter set.
If you're younger than D&D itself, you might be a reincarnated grognard.
(This is the scariest thought I've had so far today. Well, barring politics.)
Blue
Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal
Everyone would want to play a front-line character. No archers, probably no mages. Heck, everyone would want to play a tank - rogue can't take all that many hits. Barbarian rages can cut your XP in half by granting resistance.
If you have a fight you can win and you're not particularly hurt you can farm XP by being inefficient in killing the foe.
Not what I'm looking to encourage at my table.
pming
Legend
Hiya!
LOL!
It must be my old brain. ...dang you brain!...get with the program already!
Maybe you just seem like one of those rare "young body...old soul" type of people (re: wise beyond your years).
^_^
Paul L. Ming
LOL!
It must be my old brain. ...dang you brain!...get with the program already! Maybe you just seem like one of those rare "young body...old soul" type of people (re: wise beyond your years).
^_^
Paul L. Ming
mellored
Legend
How about the reverse?
Gain XP for winning without expending resources.
i.e.
1 XP for each HP remaining.
2 XP for each spell slot level remaining (level 3 slots= 6 XP).
2 XP per unspent action surge or channel divinity.
1 XP per unspent ki.
ect...
Pooled of course, you don't want the cleric to avoid healing the fighter. But that should encourage off-of-the-sheet thinking and keep things more intese even without the risk of death. Sure that last minion at the end of the adventure isn't going to kill you, but he might take away a few of your XP.
Gain XP for winning without expending resources.
i.e.
1 XP for each HP remaining.
2 XP for each spell slot level remaining (level 3 slots= 6 XP).
2 XP per unspent action surge or channel divinity.
1 XP per unspent ki.
ect...
Pooled of course, you don't want the cleric to avoid healing the fighter. But that should encourage off-of-the-sheet thinking and keep things more intese even without the risk of death. Sure that last minion at the end of the adventure isn't going to kill you, but he might take away a few of your XP.
Mercule
Adventurer
Heh. I thought you were a grognard, too. You must have an "old soul" (grognard soul?).
I'd say "bad idea". If the XP is still around combat, the PC focus will still be around combat. You might end up with different combats, though -- Rolemaster used to award monster XP to only the PC who got the killing blow and for being the first into a new area. I know of one group that had two types of characters: 1) front-line who sprinted through the dungeon, opening every door they could find and 2) clean-up crew who were constantly playing chicken waiting for the other PCs to weaken the hordes unleashed by type #1 to the point where they could get the last hit in. I guess there was the third type who neither sprinted nor lay in wait, but they didn't get as much XP, which thinned the herd a bit.
While we're tossing around potentially bad ideas, how about this one: Award XP for all encounters equal to 5-10% of the value the PCs would receive for defeating the NPC(s) in combat (or some other number based on actual analysis of desired rate of advancement). This award is whether or not combat actually occurs. So, the players are incentivized to negotiate as much as to fight. It also means that playing out the haggling with the artificer to create that magic sword actually nets them some benefit. Ditto for shopkeepers, etc. (at least at low level, which still gives some grounding for later). Another consequence of this is that, because more important people (nobles, high priests, etc.) tend to be higher level, or at least have higher-level retainers, it benefits the players more to interact with higher status personages for reasons beyond the immediate "what's the quest reward".
It would also be nice to find a way to appropriately award puzzle-solving. I don't know if an award per "real" use of a skill or tool would work, but it might be interesting.
The Crimson Binome
Hero
I was pretty tired when I wrote my response, too. Another way to start my post would have been, "Generally speaking, it's a bad idea to incentivize..."
Although in this case, I didn't spend much time thinking about it because I've already seen it in about a half dozen different games, and it never turns out well.
dagger
Adventurer
Just for data's sake here is the individual optional XP rules from the 2e DMG
CLASS-BASED
Warrior:
Per HD of creature defeated = 10 XP/level (? /HD probably)
Priest:
Per successful use of granted power = 100 XP (this would incl. turning)
Spells cast to further ethos = 100 XP/spell level (the ethos requirement wasn't noted in any of Gary's posting, iirc)
Making potion or scroll = XP value
Making permanent magical item = XP value
Wizard:
Spells cast to overcome foes or solve problems = 100 XP/spell level (DMG2 lists as 50; Gary used 100 XP, iirc)
Spells researched successfully = 500 XP/spell level
Making potion or scroll = XP value
Making permanent magical item = XP value
Rogue:
Per successful use of a special ability = 200 XP
Per gold piece value of treasure obtained = 2 XP (i wouldn't stack this with the 1 XP already gained)
Per HD of creatures defeated (bard only) = 5 XP
CLASS-BASED
Warrior:
Per HD of creature defeated = 10 XP/level (? /HD probably)
Priest:
Per successful use of granted power = 100 XP (this would incl. turning)
Spells cast to further ethos = 100 XP/spell level (the ethos requirement wasn't noted in any of Gary's posting, iirc)
Making potion or scroll = XP value
Making permanent magical item = XP value
Wizard:
Spells cast to overcome foes or solve problems = 100 XP/spell level (DMG2 lists as 50; Gary used 100 XP, iirc)
Spells researched successfully = 500 XP/spell level
Making potion or scroll = XP value
Making permanent magical item = XP value
Rogue:
Per successful use of a special ability = 200 XP
Per gold piece value of treasure obtained = 2 XP (i wouldn't stack this with the 1 XP already gained)
Per HD of creatures defeated (bard only) = 5 XP
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