Critical Role Professor DM interviews Critical Role Cast

[DEFCON 1]

You're basically defining the entire OSR, however innovative, as fantasy heartbreakers. And no, no they aren't. And neither is Daggerheart.

I'm claiming that any game that was made because someone played D&D and found something missing in D&D that they wanted in their D&D so they made their own ruleset in response to D&D is a 'fantasy heartbreaker'. Is that too broad of a definition? Maybe. Who's to say? But it's what I have chosen to use.

Now, as I mentioned right above... I also acknowledge that some people find the term 'fantasy heartbreaker' dismissive, which is why they will argue that certain games are not. Because otherwise it is tantamount to admitting this other game is "lesser" than D&D. That's fine! I have no problem with someone taking that side of the argument. I acknowledge their feelings, even if I don't hold them myself. Which just means we end up at an impasse-- I call something a 'fantasy heartbreaker' and someone else doesn't. Whatever. So be it.

 

[Parmandur]

but I bet

So, Todd Kenreck was a WotC insider when they were making those comments on the streaming scene.

It is not a one-show scene.

 

[CrashFiend82]

This might alr day have been brought up and I missed it, but comparing live play, I weirdly think Daggerheart would be a better fit for Dimension 20 over CR. I enjoy both at times for different reasons and it always felt like CR was spiritually closer to D&D versus Dimension 20 being more detached from the rules. I would really enjoy to see what that cast could do with Daggerheart. Thinking for example what Fantasy High would have been using Daggerheart, really stretching the rules and would make an awesome Campaign Frame

I watched some of Age of Umbra, but it felt like a D&D game with house rules, which is also fine. I would prefer to see the cast do a Beast Feast short campaign, I feel like Travis and Sam would make that sing. Possibly the Western Collosal (forgot the name) would be great as well.

Listening to the interview I got the feeling the whole CR team along with Darrington Press has an idea things would get very "busy" releasing Daggerheart, which makes sense for the "West Marches" campaign. I personally wonder if this is a limited form of "try-outs", see who works well with the group in live plays to potentially grow their AP "platform". As has happened in previous campaigns life happens, Ashley dropping for her TV roles, Laura and Travis having a baby, Sam's health needs. It would be good to grow their "bench" with like minded folks that can play for more than just a few drop in sessions. I feel like Robbie is already another cast member, maybe a few others.

I am just excited for Daggerheart can't find enough copies to gift out. Finishing a 5E campaign but hoping to switch over when it wraps since I think Daggerheart fits our group better. Mostly glad to have options for potential new TTRPGers, personally I think Daggerheart is actually a better introductory game than D&D.

 

[Neonchameleon]

I'm claiming that any game that was made because someone played D&D and found something missing in D&D that they wanted in their D&D so they made their own ruleset in response to D&D is a 'fantasy heartbreaker'. Is that too broad of a definition? Maybe. Who's to say? But it's what I have chosen to use.

And I am saying that by taking existing phrases and terms and inventing your own definitions of them that are at best very tangentially connected to the original meanings the only thing you do is make communication near impossible and turn the thread into "What is Defcon talking about?"

By your absurd definition Shadowrun, Traveller, Gamma World, WFRP, and many more are fantasy heartbreakers. (Yes, wanting a different setting/environment counts as wanting something else in your D&D). Yours is a ridiculous and silly reason

Now, as I mentioned right above... I also acknowledge that some people find the term 'fantasy heartbreaker' dismissive, which is why they will argue that certain games are not.

And others find it to be a specific coherent critique of a game design that is ignorant of what the wider RPG community is doing but still is a labour of love with some good ideas.

Because otherwise it is tantamount to admitting this other game is "lesser" than D&D. That's fine! I have no problem with someone taking that side of the argument. I acknowledge their feelings, even if I don't hold them myself. Which just means we end up at an impasse-- I call something a 'fantasy heartbreaker' and someone else doesn't. Whatever. So be it.

What this means is that through your humpty-dumpty-ism, using words and phrases to mean whatever you want no matter the normal meanings all you do is get in the way of productive conversation

 

[TiQuinn]

And I am saying that by taking existing phrases and terms and inventing your own definitions of them that are at best very tangentially connected to the original meanings the only thing you do is make communication near impossible and turn the thread into "What is Defcon talking about?"

In fairness, I think we all do this to some degree as part of the evolution of words but I also think that means certain terms are going to be more controversial than others. So it’s better to just cut out the term “fantasy heartbreaker” and just talk in terms of what one means. The label itself becomes pointless.

 

[Neonchameleon]

In fairness, I think we all do this to some degree as part of the evolution of words but I also think that means certain terms are going to be more controversial than others. So it’s better to just cut out the term “fantasy heartbreaker” and just talk in terms of what one means. The label itself becomes pointless.

It's basically a dead label in 2025, like "Monty Haul DM". I know I'd be fascinated to see a new one in 2025 - and wonder how it had come to exist in the age of the internet

 

[TiQuinn]

It's basically a dead label in 2025, like "Monty Haul DM". I know I'd be fascinated to see a new one in 2025 - and wonder how it had come to exist in the age of the internet

Great example. I remember when everyone terrified of the Monty Haul campaign as if it were the worst thing that could ever possibly happen, and I think even with the game at the time, it was largely a made-up problem.

 

[Morrus]

and turn the thread into "What is Defcon talking about?"

Well, that requires more than one person. Let's all put this massive sidetrack into the definition of a word aside and get back to the actual thread topic, please.

 

[DEFCON 1]

And I am saying that by taking existing phrases and terms and inventing your own definitions of them that are at best very tangentially connected to the original meanings the only thing you do is make communication near impossible and turn the thread into "What is Defcon talking about?"

By your absurd definition Shadowrun, Traveller, Gamma World, WFRP, and many more are fantasy heartbreakers. (Yes, wanting a different setting/environment counts as wanting something else in your D&D). Yours is a ridiculous and silly reason


And others find it to be a specific coherent critique of a game design that is ignorant of what the wider RPG community is doing but still is a labour of love with some good ideas.

What this means is that through your humpty-dumpty-ism, using words and phrases to mean whatever you want no matter the normal meanings all you do is get in the way of productive conversation

Are you actually looking to have a productive conversation with me? Cause you have ignored quite a bit of my points to try and get your own over.

But whatever. Believe what you want and I will do the same.

 

[Morrus]

Are you actually looking to have a productive conversation with me? Cause you have ignored quite a bit of my points to try and get your own over.

But whatever. Believe what you want and I will do the same.

I asked you nicely to drop it, but I guess you had to have one last word. You won’t be posting again in this thread. When a moderator asks you to drop a line of conversation, they mean it.