D&D 5E Psionic Mages?

[steeldragons]

Thanks for the full text of the tweets. So what it sounds like to me, is they have not written those other classes yet, and he was just talking off the top of his head about some initial starting places. That is NOT the language of someone who is settled in their ideas.

Just so. This is all a tempest in a teapot...and there's not even any tea in it yet!

 

[Kobold Avenger]

I've always felt that psionics were just another type of magic, especially when I liked another game where advanced technology and experimental science were also just another type of magic. So everything in 3.5e and beyond never bothered me about psionics. So many attempts to make psionics different just to be different have generally ruined psionics, like the direction it took back in 2e. I may not be too big on just dumping every class under the Mage class, but psionics being magic isn't one of them.

 

[bogmad]

Just so. This is all a tempest in a teapot...and there's not even any tea in it yet!

I agree. It's too soon to start prophesying doomsday over this. Still, with only one playtest package left I am a bit concerned as to how much they'll actually take into consideration. I think the mage subclass system works great for some things, others... not as much.

 

[bogmad]

I've always felt that psionics were just another type of magic, especially when I liked another game where advanced technology and experimental science were also just another type of magic. So everything in 3.5e and beyond never bothered me about psionics. So many attempts to make psionics different just to be different have generally ruined psionics, like the direction it took back in 2e. I may not be too big on just dumping every class under the Mage class, but psionics being magic isn't one of them.

But what about the people who don't want psionics to be magic?
Is there a way to make them happy along with the people who don't mind psionic magic, or do they just need to accept that they need to play the game a certain way?

 

[Kobold Avenger]

But what about the people who don't want psionics to be magic?
Is there a way to make them happy along with the people who don't mind psionic magic, or do they just need to accept that they need to play the game a certain way?

Throw them under the bus like they've done in 3.5e and beyond, sure they gave the option to have psi-resistance and magic-resistance to be different in 3.5e, but that was an option that was clearly ignored in most places. Making psionics different from magic also clearly goes against the goal of simplicity they're also aiming for in 5e.

 

[bogmad]

Throw them under the bus like they've done in 3.5e and beyond, sure they gave the option to have psi-resistance and magic-resistance to be different in 3.5e, but that was an option that was clearly ignored in most places. Making psionics different from magic also clearly goes against the goal of simplicity they're also aiming for in 5e.

I wouldn't expect to see it show up until later. Hell, make them part of an "advanced" module if you hate them and don't want them in the basic game.
Still, having one extra class with (hopefully) simple mechanics doesn't necessarily go against a simplicity goal.
What about the "respect the history of previous editions/play the game you want" goal?

[edit]Getting thrown under the bus seldom makes anyone happy. So I guess your answer is 'No"

 

[gyor]

Yes stuff like Soulmelds, Incantations, and stuff like that possibly could be swapped in by swapping out wizardary in exchange for say Pact Magic, Or Vestiage Binding, or Soulmelding which would give you a different form of magic instead of spell casting.

 

[Weather Report]

I'm still uncomfortable with Mages and Rogues having the same HD/HP, I would prefer they lower the Mage back to d4 (as it has been every edition, save 4th), or bump the Rogue to d8, like Pathfinder.

The 3rd Ed Psion is a variant Mage, the only edition to have a fully separate Psionicist class is 2nd Ed, and, boy, was that a fiddly, clunky system, and either superbly weak, or broken silly.

In 1st Ed Psionics is a bizarre tacked-on thing many ignore, that any character has a chance at obtaining at 1st level.

 

[Andor]

Psionics are obviously a supernatural power. (If you want to argue otherwise I'll be happy to watch you demonstrate telekinesis.)

With that in mind (no pun intended) the question of whether or not a Psion is it's own class depends on whether or not their powers are mechanically different enough to warrent another class. In Arcana Unearthed frex Psions are Mind Witches and are lumped into the Witch class along with Wind, Wood, Winter, Fire and Iron witches. But it you ask one of them they'll tell you they don't cast spells and aren't magic users.

Likewise can the average peseant, or you for that matter, tell the difference between pyrokinesis or a still, silenced scorching ray or fireball? No? If the guy who can incinerate your house with a thought calls himself a Wizard, a Psion or a the Queen of May you're unlikely to argue. I honestly don't see any need to split out psionics from magic, half of the magic in that Grand Father of D&D The Lord of the Rings are classic psionic powers, telepathy, mind probing, foresight, clairvoyance. For that matter the distinction might not even be clear within the world. How exactly do a self-taught Wilder and a self-taught Sorcerer know their power sources are different?

So for me it comes down the crunch rather than the fluff. If a Psion is different enough to warrant their own class they should have their own class. If it's just a magic with a slightly different spell list and casting mechanic then by all means lump it in.

 

[gyor]

You forget 4th edition which not only had the Psion class, which played very different from mages as it had no encounter powers and used power points, along with 2 other psionic classes, 4e Empathic Ardent, and Battlemind (I'm not including the monk as that was weird and forced). Even in 3rd it was seperate, you could multiclass wizard psion no problem. Plus it had Divine Mind, Osi Warrior, Soul Knife, Lurker, Divine Mind, and the 3.5 Philosphical Ardent. So I'm not sure what you mean by the Psion was a mage variant?