D&D 4E Questions for my very first 4E Character/Adventure.

[Theolas]

First I'd like to say that I just discovered EnWorld and am thoroughly enjoying the treasure trove of info! i just had to join immediately so I could start asking all of the questions running through my head. Anyway, here goes my very first line of questioning:

So, after quite some time (literally years) I find myself with enough time to get back into some PnP and am a former AD&D2E and am excited to try out 4E. I'm gearing up for my first adventure and am rolling up my first character which is to be a Ranger. Also, I have spent some time with the 3.5 ruleset and am pretty familiar with it so most of my comparisons come from there. Anyway, here are some of my questions:

1. So there is no TWF feats or combat dynamic at all? (actually kind of a rhetorical question).

2. If, as a Ranger, I have proficiency with all Martial weaps without penalty why would I wield anything other than a GreatAxe for my Melee, since there are no THF preqs? It seems I am missing something.

3. Any opinions on D&D Encounters? I was thinking of jumping in on Aug 13th.

Cool, thanks in advance for any input.

Theo

 

[Neonchameleon]

First I'd like to say that I just discovered EnWorld and am thoroughly enjoying the treasure trove of info! i just had to join immediately so I could start asking all of the questions running through my head. Anyway, here goes my very first line of questioning:

So, after quite some time (literally years) I find myself with enough time to get back into some PnP and am a former AD&D2E and am excited to try out 4E. I'm gearing up for my first adventure and am rolling up my first character which is to be a Ranger. Also, I have spent some time with the 3.5 ruleset and am pretty familiar with it so most of my comparisons come from there. Anyway, here are some of my questions:

1. So there is no TWF feats or combat dynamic at all? (actually kind of a rhetorical question).

2. If, as a Ranger, I have proficiency with all Martial weaps without penalty why would I wield anything other than a GreatAxe for my Melee, since there are no THF preqs? It seems I am missing something.

3. Any opinions on D&D Encounters? I was thinking of jumping in on Aug 13th.

Cool, thanks in advance for any input.

Theo

1/2: Your skill in 4e is more based on your powers than your feats. If you are playing a Ranger (and don't have Martial Power 2) you can't choose any powers that are really usable with a two handed weapon so you're reliant on Melee Basic Attacks. This means that for all practical purposes you're only about as good with a greataxe as a wizard with greataxe proficiency. On the other hand as a Ranger you can e.g. take the Twin Strike At Will. Which gives you an attack with each weapon with no to hit penalty. The powers are where a lot of the customisation is hiding, and your at will powers are the heart of your character - what they do when they aren't sure what to do.

3: Have fun and use it to find a home-group. They are very railroady.

 

[Ajar]

To wield two weapons effectively, you need to take powers that use them. Twin Strike is the obvious level 1 candidate. Rangers have pretty robust dual wielding support, since it's one of their signature features. You probably also want to take the Two-Blade Style or Marauder Style class feature.

A greataxe has a lower proficiency bonus than other weapons. You're sacrificing attack bonus for higher damage. Edit: In past editions, you suffered a penalty when using a weapon you weren't proficient with. In 4E, you get a proficiency bonus when you use a weapon you're proficient with, and no proficiency bonus otherwise. Different weapons have different proficiency bonuses.

 

[Theolas]

Wow, um, ok. Obviously I need to more homework. It does makes sense with the xplanations given I just don't remember seeing this stuff in the PHB, or at least not explained in detail.

I intend on making a Archer Ranger, mostly because I think I will have the most fun with it, but figured I still needed to take into account what I would melee with when the time comes (as, inevitably, it will). So I guess I'll go Two Weaps for Melee, which leads to this question;

Any reason not to go Dual Longswords then? I mean, once the Powers are there, I won't have to deal with an Off-Hand Penalty as in 3.5.

 

[Scrivener of Doom]

This is where Encounters can be really good: it lets you try out your character mechanically before you play it in a "real" game.

Do you have a DDi subscription so you can access the online character builder?

 

[Theolas]

Nah, not yet. I wanted to get some play time in (and a better understanding) before I did that. I did purchase a PHB though.

I should just get a sub but I'm married and don't want to have to explain it to the wife until I can show I'm going to be dedicating some time in that direction for a while. Lol!!

 

[Scrivener of Doom]

OK, but you should grab the errata from the WotC website as a fair bit has changed.

Also, you do need to decide whether to be an archer ranger or a two-weapon ranger. While you can take powers of either sort, you are generally better off specialising in a particular style.

 

[DEFCON 1]

If you have just the first PHB... then yes, you can take Twin Strike as one of your at-will powers. This power that allows you to attack twice can be used with both ranged weapons and dual-wielded weapons. So you can start the fight at range and get to fire two arrows per round using Twin Strike, and then if a monster runs up to engage you in melee, you can switch over to your swords and attack twice per round using Twin Strike as well (one attack from each weapon.)

As far as your question as to why you wouldn't wield two longswords... you certainly can, *if* you take the 'two-blade fighting style' rather than the 'archer fighting style'. Ordinarily, you would have to wield a weapon with the 'Off-hand' property in your off-hand (which would preclude longswords)... but the 'two-blade fighting style' allows you to use a regular one-handed weapon in your off-hand (which the longsword is.)

You could also dual-wield battleaxes, or picks, or warhammers or whatever you wanted to use.

 

[Neonchameleon]

Wow, um, ok. Obviously I need to more homework. It does makes sense with the xplanations given I just don't remember seeing this stuff in the PHB, or at least not explained in detail.

I intend on making a Archer Ranger, mostly because I think I will have the most fun with it, but figured I still needed to take into account what I would melee with when the time comes (as, inevitably, it will). So I guess I'll go Two Weaps for Melee, which leads to this question;

Any reason not to go Dual Longswords then? I mean, once the Powers are there, I won't have to deal with an Off-Hand Penalty as in 3.5.

The 4e PHB really isn't good at explaining what it's doing. It's useful for looking things up and finding the information you need - but awful at teaching people to play.

And you'll need a melee weapon with an archer ranger a lot less than you think you will. Other than Twin Strike, the Archer Ranger can make their second at will attack one that can take a 1 square shift before making their normal attack. A 1 square shift is cautiously moving 5ft - or in the case of the archer, backing out of melee range without taking an opportunity attack so they can fire safely. All as part of their attack action (meaning that if they start their turn either dazed or prone they can still use it). And there's no penalty for firing into melee. (I forget the name of the At Will). Pinning down an archer ranger so they can't shoot in 4e is a challenge. And the advantage of shooting is you get to use your dex rather than your strength (and if you want to take the risk you can dump strength as a stat).

(If you're the sort of tactician I am you might deliberately provoke the opportunity attack anyway; if the fighter has marked the person you are going to provoke (marking as in basketball or football) the opportunity attack takes a -2 penalty and (more importantly) the fighter gets a free attack on them with Combat Challenge).

And you take a -2 penalty for a main hand weapon in your offhand - unless you take the two weapon ranger option that allows you to ignore this penalty (and gives you the Toughness feat)

 

[S'mon]

Archer Ranger is probably the simplest and most effective class & build in the game, so good choice. Here's how you play him:

1. Are any enemies adjacent to you? If so, Move action: say "I shift to here" (1 space away from that enemy).
2. Minor action: say "I quarry (nearest enemy)"
3. Standard action: say "I Twin Strike" - roll two bow attacks, one after the other (they are separate attacks so you can decide to which target if you kill with one shot), first at your Quarry. Remember to add your Quarry damage die to the first time you hit him.
4. Profit.