Ranger assistance

[Marius]

Okay, so I know that Ranger isn't an intensely popular class, but I enjoy roleplaying it, and love the speed factor. Most people I've seen complain about rangers always either forget, or don't care that they get two weapon fighting and abidexterity to start with, and that's just so much fun from a melee perspective.

In any event, my question has to do with feats. I'm not too hyped on the favored enemy stuff I've seen, but here's what I've got thus far.

I'm a 3/1 ranger/fighter. All of the standard ranger feats, plus, due to the level of fighter at third level, Point-blank shot, Rapid Shot, and Precise Shot.

Where do I go from here? Improved crit seems neat, except if I ever give up long swords, or get a mighty composite longbow later, it would be wasted. Far shot is cool, but not really increasing my speed or power. So what do you guys think? I want to make him a quick, hard hitting combatant, essentially, if that gives any direction. Thanks in advance!

 

[Mathew_Freeman]

Well firstly, Improved Critical has a prerequisite of BAB+8, so you can't take that...

Do you have Quick Draw yet? Very important for Rangers! Improved Initiative never hurts, either.

 

[The Souljourner]

I really like Shield Expert - lets you take advantage of two weapon fighting without losing the benefits of sword & shield. By taking one level of another class you open up the opportunity to put Extra Favored Enemy to its best use - at 6th level you take level 5 of ranger. You also get a level based feat. Take the feat as Extra Favored Enemy... it is immediately incremented by your level 5 ranger favored enemy, giving you +2/+2/+1 for your favored enemies... not bad, huh?

I also like a level or two of barbarian for ranger... the increased movement is very much in character, and being able to rage is handy, and uncanny dodge at second level is great. Plus, barbarians get decent skillpoints, even if their list is a little disappointing.

I'm starting a human Ranger 2/Barbarian 1, so I know what you're going through. I'm probably going to be taking run, shield expert, and stealthy (run and stealthy because of a prestige class I'm working towards).

Let me know how it goes.

-The Souljourner

 

[Marius]

I really like Shield Expert - lets you take advantage of two >weapon fighting without losing the benefits of sword & shield. >By taking one level of another class you open up the >opportunity to put Extra Favored Enemy to its best use - at 6th >level you take level 5 of ranger. You also get a level based >feat. Take the feat as Extra Favored Enemy... it is immediately >incremented by your level 5 ranger favored enemy, giving you >+2/+2/+1 for your favored enemies... not bad, huh?

That's cool and all, but I really don't get excited by the favored enemies. A +1 or +2 modifier to a specific creature? It just seems like there's a better use of feats.

>I also like a level or two of barbarian for ranger... the increased >movement is very much in character, and being able to rage is >handy, and uncanny dodge at second level is great. Plus, >barbarians get decent skillpoints, even if their list is a little >disappointing.

Being quick and mobile is in character to a ranger, most definitely, but how can you justify picking up a level of barbarian, without it being metagaming? My ranger suddenly goes feral, and no longer recognizes the mores of society? I mean, maybe I'm reading too much into the concept of a barbarian, but it seems hard to explain in a way that doesn't sound like "I want a dextrous barbarian". That particular multi-class seems to really dilute the essence of a ranger. Just my 2 cents.

 

[Marius]

Well firstly, Improved Critical has a prerequisite of BAB+8, so you can't take that...

Do you have Quick Draw yet? Very important for Rangers! Improved Initiative never hurts, either.

Two good suggestions! Yeah, switching back and forth between the dual blades and the bow does get time-consuming, and getting the drop more often wouldn't hurt.

Thanks!

 

[The Souljourner]

If you don't get excited by Favored Enemies, you probably shouldn't be playing a ranger. A fighter/rogue is pretty much just plain better than a ranger without his favored enemies (and arguably, even *with* his favored enemies).

You don't think Barbarians and Rangers go well together? I always figured them for being two sides of the same coin. Some people have even combined the two classes! Just think of it as the results of spending a lot of time off on your own in the wilderness. You go a little feral, taking on the characteristics of the animals you've spent so much time with. Not really a big jump.

-The Souljourner

 

[Marius]

If you don't get excited by Favored Enemies, you probably shouldn't be playing a ranger. A fighter/rogue is pretty much just plain better than a ranger without his favored enemies (and arguably, even *with* his favored enemies).

You don't think Barbarians and Rangers go well together? I always figured them for being two sides of the same coin. Some people have even combined the two classes! Just think of it as the results of spending a lot of time off on your own in the wilderness. You go a little feral, taking on the characteristics of the animals you've spent so much time with. Not really a big jump.

-The Souljourner

Like I was saying, I'm more interested in the Ranger for the roleplaying aspects, IE tracking, wilderness lore, animal handling, and later the spells. Insofar as battle goes, I am viewing them as pure speed demons, which is why the two handed fighting is so important. They will never do as much damage as a barbarian, but they can spread it around further and faster.

My point was not that they dont mesh well, but that I didnt understand how one could take a level in barbarian later, after picking ANY other class. I mean, I'm spending time in cities and dungeons with a group of other, presumably social creatures, exposing me to their beliefs. I can already read several languages, and the ranger specifically is known to be disciplined, and tied to the land around him. It just seems like taking a class for the benefits, as opposed to actually adapting a growing, logical character. Like I said, the barbarian is good for running speed and rages. If thats what you want, just choose a barbarian.

 

[Chun-tzu]

I'd go with an archery or two-weapon feat.

Improved Rapid Shot (from Dragon Magazine)
Prerequisites: Dex 13+, Point Blank Shot, Rapid Shot, BAB +2

When using the Rapid Shot feat, you may ignore the -2 penalty on all your ranged attacks.


For 2-weapon fighting, Off-Hand Parry from Sword and Fist lets you get a +2 on AC by using your off-hand weapon for defense. Pin Shield lets you bypass their shield bonus. Twin Sword Style, from FRCS, gives you a +2 bonus on AC when using 2 weapons.

 

[ConcreteBuddha]

Improved Rapid Shot (from Dragon Magazine)
Prerequisites: Dex 13+, Point Blank Shot, Rapid Shot, BAB +2

When using the Rapid Shot feat, you may ignore the -2 penalty on all your ranged attacks.

This is a banned feat in my games.

 

[Marius]

I'd go with an archery or two-weapon feat.

Improved Rapid Shot (from Dragon Magazine)
Prerequisites: Dex 13+, Point Blank Shot, Rapid Shot, BAB +2

When using the Rapid Shot feat, you may ignore the -2 penalty on all your ranged attacks.


For 2-weapon fighting, Off-Hand Parry from Sword and Fist lets you get a +2 on AC by using your off-hand weapon for defense. Pin Shield lets you bypass their shield bonus. Twin Sword Style, from FRCS, gives you a +2 bonus on AC when using 2 weapons.

Cool...improved quick shot would definitely be welcome, especially seeing as how when I hit 6th, Ill have two sets of attacks, +6 and +1, and I think the -2 would then apply to two shots, as opposed to just 1. SO the twin sword style just erases the negative two from the secondary attack, and gives a +2 to the primary weapon? That's cool, if thats the case, though I don't know if my DM will allow it, as it destroys the main thing discouraging dual wielding, IE, the -2 modifier. But again, at level 6, I would then get 4 attacks melee, with the plusses, and no minuses.

As far as the off-hand parry feat, if I got to the point where I used this alot, I would just use a shield in my offhand, rather than sacrificing my second attack for a less than decent shield.

Thanks though, those are definitely finalists. Right in line with my need for speed.