[Rant] is D&D going the way of the CCG?

[Drawmack]

I am on a pretty tight budget. I usually spend about $20 a month on rpg stuff, which means usually saving for two months to get a single book. So I am going to stop buying rpg stuff in March, then I have march, april, may, june & july = 5 * 20 = 100 which leave me enough extra for a mini or two when I pick up the new books.

On top of that, how many of you house rule some stuff now? So you wind up taking 3e and 3.5e and coming up with 3.25e which is your own blanding of the two.

Also if you were versioning it like software it would be version 3.10, right now we're in like 3.02 or somthing like that. The first number is the version. The second number is the revision number and the third number is the build or the printing.

 

[BryonD]

I understand that Wizards wants to make money.

I understand their concept of a "living game" that they want to make better.

I understand that Microsoft makes money the same way.

I don't understand where that makes it right.


However, I do understand that companies will continue to do this as long as people continue to buy their products. I just wish I could not have to worry about shilling out $90 bucks for a new ruleset every 3-5 years. It's not even the problem of shilling out that kinda money -- it's shilling it out all at once. I already have enough trouble with my wife when I pick up one hardcover... but three? She's gonna skin me alive, and feed me to that new Pit Fiend...


3E has been out for two years. We've had a lot good games with it. We've had a few problems with it. I played White Wolf through second edition into Revised, and I didn't complain when the new books came out, because I'd gotten my money's worth out of them because I'd had them for four years before the new edition came out.

I think my last word on this is I'd be less wary of a version to 3E if it the ruleset was a little older (like 4 years) -- that's my major problem with the whole deal.

Where it is made right is that it is a voluntary exchange between free, consenting, self-responsible individuals. If you don't meet any of these criteria, you are completely at liberty to not participate.

As to spending all the money at once, you are talking about something that is 6 months away. Start "spending" now. Put $15 dollars away each month and come July you can buy all three books without having to impact your budget all at once.

And by the time the books come out, 3E will have been around for 3 years. To say that 4 years is needed as a major problem seems really nit-picky for such a subjective choice.

 

[Mordane76]

Where it is made right is that it is a voluntary exchange between free, consenting, self-responsible individuals. If you don't meet any of these criteria, you are completely at liberty to not participate.

As to spending all the money at once, you are talking about something that is 6 months away. Start "spending" now. Put $15 dollars away each month and come July you can buy all three books without having to impact your budget all at once.

And by the time the books come out, 3E will have been around for 3 years. To say that 4 years is needed as a major problem seems really nit-picky for such a subjective choice.

I'm sorry if I sounded a bit... subjective or ungrateful. I'm looking at this from my own perspective, and that year actually means a bit to me. And, even if I do save the money up over the next few months, it won't matter to my wife -- we already argue enough about my gaming as it is. I could save all I want, and still get the lecture of a lifetime spending $90 in one sitting on hardcovers. It's not like I buy books every month... I buy Dragon every month, and I get a book usually every three or four. My wife just don't like my hobby...

But I will admit -- my problems aren't the problems of the community at large; they are my own. This is a forum of opinion, however, so I thought I'd voice mine, because I'm sure some people have similar feelings; they might not have the exact same reasons and sentiments, but there is that similiarity of effect.

 

[Lizard]

This quote from the Revised D&D FAQ really concerns me. Although the official word is that the revisions will improve the game, the fact is that Wizards is just trying to milk more money out of us. (Deletia) If it ain't broke, don't fix it!

Doesn't ANYONE read the FAQs?

All of the new rules will be put in the SRD when they are released. You will be able to DL them for free. So, you won't have to pay a dime.

Secondly, obviously, some things ARE broke -- people have been bitching about the ranger since day 1 -- so they're fixing them.

 

[Mouseferatu]

Although the official word is that the revisions will improve the game, the fact is that Wizards is just trying to milk more money out of us

No name calling, as agreed, but this disgusts me. How the hell can you claim to know what the "truth" is? Does WotC want to make money? Of course they do. They're a company. Does that mean that's the only reason they're doing 3.5, and that it's just intended to force you to spend your money? Of course not, and anyone who claims otherwise hasn't bothered to think the argument through.

Though it's been said before, I'll say it again. All of this is going into the SRD. Pretty much immediately.

So, WotC is running a "scam," and they'll top it off by providing the necessary info for free to those who don't want to buy it. Oh, that's a brilliant scheme.

As both a gamer and a professional in the industry, I can say from both standpoints that WotC has been nothing but courteous and anxious to help. I haven't always agreed with all their decisions, but they've always gone above and beyond to help everyone adapt to those decisions. To see them insulted on the basis of half-truths and a single quoted sentence that may or may not mean what you think it does just turns my stomach.

You want to express an opinion? Fine. Don't pretend that what you're expressing is hard and cold fact, though, because it's not even close.

 

[Zaruthustran]

I agree with this rant! Haw DARE WotC fix a broken product, then give it to the entire world for free?! I am personally insulted, and this is proof that WotC hates me, specifically me!

Good grief.

I shudder to think of how certain players will react when D&D 4th Edition is announced.

Actually, I'm sort of looking forward to that, in a "tease the kids who ride the short bus" kind of way.

Seriously, I'm shocked at how folks are outraged or surprised by changes to the rule set/new releases of the core D&D rules. D&D is a franchise, and just like James Bond, Magic, Windows, Harry Potter, or any other non-consumable franchise product, we're going to see consecutive editions as long as WotC is able to make them and we're all willing to buy them.

Arguing about specific changes to the rules, or the layout of the books, or whatever is all fine and good--that's what fan sites are for. But complaining when WotC acts on those rules arguments by releasing a Revised Edition? Wow.

Besides, even after they revise the rules how are we going to know that they aren't going to revise them further? No set of rules is going to please every player, especially with such a diverse audience as D&D players (you just have to read the boards to see the differences in opinions regarding how the rules should be built to see this diversity). Just as Wizards continually updates Magic and constantly revises the rules, Wizards is bound to update D&D again before long since it's a "living game". Although 3e isn't perfect it's far better than any previous edition. If it ain't broke, don't fix it!

We know that WotC *will* "revise [the rules] further." Common business sense tells us that WotC will release new editions to the D&D community. A rational company would not ignore the opportunity, and we've got to assume that WotC is rational.

Example:
You really like rocks. I have blue rocks for sale. You buy my blue rock. You mostly enjoy your blue rock, although you're not 100% satisfied with the color. Since you already have a blue rock you won't buy any more. But my market research tells me that if I make a red rock, you'll probably buy it. Why in the world would I choose to *not* make and sell you that red rock?

-z

 

[BryonD]

I'm sorry if I sounded a bit... subjective or ungrateful. I'm looking at this from my own perspective, and that year actually means a bit to me. And, even if I do save the money up over the next few months, it won't matter to my wife -- we already argue enough about my gaming as it is. I could save all I want, and still get the lecture of a lifetime spending $90 in one sitting on hardcovers. It's not like I buy books every month... I buy Dragon every month, and I get a book usually every three or four. My wife just don't like my hobby...

But I will admit -- my problems aren't the problems of the community at large; they are my own. This is a forum of opinion, however, so I thought I'd voice mine, because I'm sure some people have similar feelings; they might not have the exact same reasons and sentiments, but there is that similiarity of effect.

That is cool.

I can understand your perspective.

Though my wife plays D&D, so I don't share your problem. Sorry for that.

Anyway, I don't have the slightest problem with you not likeing it for yourself, but I get a bit defensive when it is suggested that it is not right for someone else to offer something to me. I took your post that way.
Now that I understand your position better, I have no complaint against it. Good luck getting the books!!!

 

[Darrin Drader]

*High fives mouseferatu*

You go!

Actually the only issue I have with this whole thing is what I'm going to do with my old books. I hear they make good paperweights. Maybe I should send them to the starving children in Ethiopia.

 

[barsoomcore]

I could save all I want, and still get the lecture of a lifetime spending $90 in one sitting on hardcovers.

I don't want to presume, Mordane, but are you aware of the existence of the SRD? It is the Standard Reference Document for d20 rules and is available online here.

This is the complete (though spartan) rules to the d20 system, and will be updated for 3.5.

You don't need to buy the books unless you want the new pictures and explanatory text.

But the rules are being made available to the community at large, for free.

Then Zarathustran said this:
I shudder to think of how certain players will react when D&D 4th Edition is announced.

Actually, I'm sort of looking forward to that, in a "tease the kids who ride the short bus" kind of way.
That's gotta be the funniest thing I've heard all day. Thanks for that.

 

[francisca]

I'd like to see Wizards release the revisions via the SRD as soon as they are in their final form. I mean, if they are going to give them away for free anyway, why wait until the books hit the store shelves? Maybe they could release the revised SRD the day they send the books off to be printed.

Why? The sooner I can see what changes are going to be made, the sooner I can decide if I want to incorporate some changes or adopt 3.whatever in full.

And I am just plain impatient...