[Rant] On Spell Focus...

Remathilis

Legend
This is a bit of a musing on the revision of spell-focus as it (seems) to relate to the rest of 3.5.

Why is spell focus nerfed? Is it really that much worse than before? Here out my arguments and rebuttals (yes, I'm playing both sides) to see which side you think you fall under. Enter only with a open mind (yes, that means you too Psion. ;) )

The Pro's.

* Symmentry. Weapon Focus is a feat that grants +1 to hit with a chosen weapon. Spell Focus is a feat that grants +1 to DCs of a chosen school. Symmentry. Greater X Focus grants a stacking +1 to each of the appropriate base feats. These feats now are more aligned in base power. (Actually, Spell Focus has the advantage of affecting only 1 of 8 possible choices, as opposed the countless weapons in the game.)
* Its a Base Feat. Few "base feats" or feats that start chains are a great as other feats with more pre-reqs. Compare it to weapon focus, dodge, or point blank shot, and you see they grant the same bonus, +1 to their appropriate ability.
* There are still the traditional ways to boost DCs, Heighten Spell, Animal Buffer Spells (even with shorter durations), Stat Booster Magic Items, PrC's (even if their aren't many the core, there are PLENTY in outside sources and surly more to come), even more in books like Tome in Blood (Co-Op Spell?).
* It makes the Save Booster Feats (Iron Will, etc.) More valuable because your beating the caster's 2-1. Many less charmed fighters at high levels! :D
* It reigns in some very powerful high level wizards (I personally saw a wizard with a base DC to saves of 25! + Caster Level Prismatic Spray and Disintergrate an entire module without breaking a sweat. Next level, he would have taken a level of Archmage had a dracolich not dropped him and all his stuff into a pool of acid.)
* As an added bonus, it adds another reign on the Mystic Theurge!
* Its still a useful feat. Even if its not a good as it was in 3e (see harm, haste, hold), that doesn't mean its not a useful feat to have. Less useful true, but useful nonetheless.

THE CONS.
* Why 2 for 1. Simply not making GSF core and leaving DM's to incorporate it in would not have made SF broken.
* Ditto with nerfling Archmage.
* Its absolutley pointless for non-dedicated casters. (Rangers, Bards, multi-classes)
* It makes it harder to beat monsters of equal CR*
* It foils backwards compatiblity.
* It weakens casters yet again, esp. those without uber scores.
* Thanks to the shorter animal buffs, its going to be hard to get descent spell DCs.

Well, I'm sure you can think of more than I have, but I personally don't think the change will result in any major loss of power, and maybe a few less uber transmuters/evokers and thier 20something + spell level DCs.

EDIT: * note on CR in cons, I, of course, haven't played the revised, so this is pure speculation and not rhe result of actual play-testing.
 
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I like the change.

The bonus to DC was too good to pass up. It's a must-have for wizards, and no feat should be a must-have.

... and to say the Archmage is "nerfed" is like saying that the red dragon the party is about to face has a broken nail.
 

Ignore BiggusGeekus, Remathlis. He is wrong.

Andy Collins and the rest of the IDIOTS at WoTC have already said "Feel free to use the 3.0 spell focus as long as you don't use Greater Spell Focus ".

I'm like, why didn't you structure it that way in the first place?

Anyway, I know my DM is keeping SF at +2 while also banning GSF...hopefully yours will too (and I think it's a fair compromise).

Edit: you are wrong about one thing though - SF is still a good feat for "non-dedicated spellcasters". Why wouldn't a bard take SF: Enchantment? If anything it's MORE important for a bard to take that than a wizard.
 
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We've not been able to play the new edition yet and people are complaining about stuff being nerfed or to overpowered. It's not just this thread as much as others. I say wait till you actually play 3.5 to determine if something is nerfed or overpowered.

As for the new spell focus, I don't really care, I'll be playing AU in a few weeks as my normal game! :D
 

ph34r said:
I say wait till you actually play 3.5 to determine if something is nerfed or overpowered.

That's sound advice. Hard to say exactly how things will balance out when everything is taken into consideration at the game table and in play.
 


Mark said:


That's sound advice. Hard to say exactly how things will balance out when everything is taken into consideration at the game table and in play.

Actually that's boring advice. It pretty much kills the thread, and we'd like to talk about the nerfing of spell focus, thank you very much, even without every last tidbit of information. Thanks. ok, bah-bye.
 

Zogg said:
Actually that's boring advice. It pretty much kills the thread, and we'd like to talk about the nerfing of spell focus, thank you very much, even without every last tidbit of information. Thanks. ok, bah-bye.

Hmmm... The first post said to enter with an open mind and my opinion is to keep it open until getting the chance to play with all of the rules, together, as revised. Seems you have zogged when you should have zagged... ;)
 

Mark said:


Hmmm... The first post said to enter with an open mind and my opinion is to keep it open until getting the chance to play with all of the rules, together, as revised. Seems you have zogged when you should have zagged... ;)

Fair enough. But we have learned a few things already, some which already don't gel:

1. SF and GSF are reduced to stackable +1 each in 3.5E (cited on this website, in Dragon magazine, at WoTC, etc.)

2. Andy Collins himself has said (and I quote): "If you disallow GSF in your game, you'd almost certainly be OK leaving SF at +2."

cited here: http://pub36.ezboard.com/fgameschat19968frm10.showMessage?topicID=357.topic

Sure, I can "wait until all the information is out", but I've already received conflicting information.

In one instance, the designers are saying a +2 to DC should be broken down into 2 feats, yet in another, they are saying "it's ok" to have +2 DC to be one feat as long as you don't use GSF.

The problem HERE is that under 3.5E, you can't get a +4 to your DC as you could in 3.0E - so WHY make 2 feats do what 1 did in 3.0 instead of eliminating the ONE troublemaker feat. It's assanine, and I don't need to wait until July 18ish to figure that out.
 

Zogg said:
I'm like, why didn't you structure it that way in the first place?

Were this billed as an entirely new edition, and by default not compatible, that might work. However, it needs to be compatible with what has gone before, by either editing what has gone before, or by making sure it was stackable. This is the same rationale behind incorporating the Archmage and the Red Wizard into the Core rules. It's Pandora's Game Rules.

By ignoring the existance of GSF, it would leave it open for incorporation by existing splat books and others.

Anyway, I know my DM is keeping SF at +2 while also banning GSF...hopefully yours will too (and I think it's a fair compromise).

Good alternate change.
 

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