Darth K'Trava
First Post
Tewligan said:
Hey! Cobra Commander was kewl!!!
-
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<Rant> Where has courtesy gone?
- Thread starter Harmon
- Start date
Hey! Cobra Commander was kewl!!!
Captain Howdy
Explorer
Harmon said:
You're welcome, good sir! Have a nice day now.
Tatsukun
Danjin Masutaa
Two things to add..
1) This whole thing about telling kids “Fear strangers” is silly. They don’t fear the bad guys, they only end up fearing everyone else. I used to work in a big university, and I often see parents and their kids walking on our campus. I often say “Hello” to the family, and 9 times out of 10 the mother grabs the child, and shoves him/her behind herself as if to protect from the freak who DARES talk to her family (child included).
Of course, it has bad effects. Just recently there was that Boy Scout lost in the woods for 4 days because he was scared to talk to the ‘strangers’ in the search and rescue parties who were looking for him.
That’s sad.
2) I lost my wallet (dropped it on the subway train) a few months ago. It contained my ID, money, and various cards. I figured it was gone, and had the cards canceled and all that. Well, a few days later I get a call from the police station. Someone found my wallet, and turned it in the same day. They had been holding it for my, waiting for me to contact them. Of course, everything was in the wallet when I got it back.
The lesson is that if I had had a little faith in humans and checked if anyone had turned it in I wouldn’t have had to go to all the trouble of canceling my cards.
--Tatsu
1) This whole thing about telling kids “Fear strangers” is silly. They don’t fear the bad guys, they only end up fearing everyone else. I used to work in a big university, and I often see parents and their kids walking on our campus. I often say “Hello” to the family, and 9 times out of 10 the mother grabs the child, and shoves him/her behind herself as if to protect from the freak who DARES talk to her family (child included).
Of course, it has bad effects. Just recently there was that Boy Scout lost in the woods for 4 days because he was scared to talk to the ‘strangers’ in the search and rescue parties who were looking for him.
That’s sad.
2) I lost my wallet (dropped it on the subway train) a few months ago. It contained my ID, money, and various cards. I figured it was gone, and had the cards canceled and all that. Well, a few days later I get a call from the police station. Someone found my wallet, and turned it in the same day. They had been holding it for my, waiting for me to contact them. Of course, everything was in the wallet when I got it back.
The lesson is that if I had had a little faith in humans and checked if anyone had turned it in I wouldn’t have had to go to all the trouble of canceling my cards.
--Tatsu
stevelabny
Explorer
a few random notes about this thread,
do you know whats rude to me?
having every conversation fiilled with endless amounts of pleases, thank yous, your welcomes, and meaningless other pleasantries.
life is short. time is valuable, if i say "pass the salt" and not "pass the salt, you >censored<" then PLEASE is implied.
a thank you among strangers is OK, but it is completely unnecessary with people you are with on a regular basis (friends, family, coworkers, etc)
if someone is in your way, say excuse me, and keep walking. if theyre standing in a doorway or at the top or bottom of a staircase, its rude only if you dont tell them how stupid they are.
the problem with holding the door / giving up the seat and other chilvarous deeds is that since the 80s many women have decided that these things are more insulting than polite. if they cant make their minds up, i have no desire to play along. Add into this the problem of me being a big guy, and everyone being afraid that all strangers are psycho killers and its just not worth the hassle.
I've seen people expect that I should give up a seat on a bus or subway because I'm a "young man". Well, guess what. You have no idea what my health status might be. I could have a bad back, or a sprained ankle or any other problem that would be better off seated. Also, EXPECTING someone to give up a seat is rude. Why do I have to say PLEASE to get some salt at dinner, but you can't say "can i please have that seat?" The double standards are ridiculous. I've given my seat to anyone who ever asked for it. And, if I'm in a particularly nice mood, to stupid old crippled women or pregnant women. Of course, the general rule of thumb should be "if youre not healthy enough to survive standing up, DON'T ride public transportation"
The political correctness of America is another problem. Look how everyone wants to treat wheelchair guy differently than every other rude person in this thread. If you think he's rude, call him out on it.
Then look at all the dinsgenuity in the "politeness" that many businesses and condescending elderly people throw around.
And as one final note, the "bless you" thing DEFINITELY doesnt fly. Much like all talk of religion isn't allowed around here, why do you think you can get away with blessing people you don't know? I don't follow your god, and I don't want his blessing.
I'm very not-rude. I don't talk in theatres, I'm friendly and social with strangers, if you ask me to do something for you, and I can... I will.
BUT i'm not "polite". Polite is a waste of time. Polite does nothing for anyone. Polite is just one more lie that your parents told you.
Give me honesty and efficiency any day of the week.
do you know whats rude to me?
having every conversation fiilled with endless amounts of pleases, thank yous, your welcomes, and meaningless other pleasantries.
life is short. time is valuable, if i say "pass the salt" and not "pass the salt, you >censored<" then PLEASE is implied.
a thank you among strangers is OK, but it is completely unnecessary with people you are with on a regular basis (friends, family, coworkers, etc)
if someone is in your way, say excuse me, and keep walking. if theyre standing in a doorway or at the top or bottom of a staircase, its rude only if you dont tell them how stupid they are.
the problem with holding the door / giving up the seat and other chilvarous deeds is that since the 80s many women have decided that these things are more insulting than polite. if they cant make their minds up, i have no desire to play along. Add into this the problem of me being a big guy, and everyone being afraid that all strangers are psycho killers and its just not worth the hassle.
I've seen people expect that I should give up a seat on a bus or subway because I'm a "young man". Well, guess what. You have no idea what my health status might be. I could have a bad back, or a sprained ankle or any other problem that would be better off seated. Also, EXPECTING someone to give up a seat is rude. Why do I have to say PLEASE to get some salt at dinner, but you can't say "can i please have that seat?" The double standards are ridiculous. I've given my seat to anyone who ever asked for it. And, if I'm in a particularly nice mood, to stupid old crippled women or pregnant women. Of course, the general rule of thumb should be "if youre not healthy enough to survive standing up, DON'T ride public transportation"
The political correctness of America is another problem. Look how everyone wants to treat wheelchair guy differently than every other rude person in this thread. If you think he's rude, call him out on it.
Then look at all the dinsgenuity in the "politeness" that many businesses and condescending elderly people throw around.
And as one final note, the "bless you" thing DEFINITELY doesnt fly. Much like all talk of religion isn't allowed around here, why do you think you can get away with blessing people you don't know? I don't follow your god, and I don't want his blessing.
I'm very not-rude. I don't talk in theatres, I'm friendly and social with strangers, if you ask me to do something for you, and I can... I will.
BUT i'm not "polite". Polite is a waste of time. Polite does nothing for anyone. Polite is just one more lie that your parents told you.
Give me honesty and efficiency any day of the week.
mojo1701
First Post
stevelabny said:
I don't know about you, but if someone brushes past me, and says "Excuse me" or apologizes, I feel better, and don't necessarily think that the person's a jerk.
Oh, and I believe that this attitude of your is the problem that we're discussing here.
Oh, and honesty and efficiency works for robots, not humans.
Darth K'Trava
First Post
stevelabny said:
But it should be forthcoming, implied or not. Shows you're being polite.
I disagree here. Even friends deserve a "thank you" if they do something for you, especially things you don't ask for or even stuff you *do* ask for. It's courteous. And the same goes for if you do something for them and they should also thank you as well. It's a two-way street; not just limited to strangers. Your friends deserve it too. I've done alot of stuff for a friend of mine and he's thanked me for it; showed his gratitude for my generosity.
Huh? Is this New York state of thinking here? That's rude if you DO tell them they're stupid for being in your way!
I'm a woman and I don't mind a man being a gentleman and holding doors open for me. Granted I don't go for that whole "women's lib" stuff.. I still like some of the "old-fashioned" stuff that nice guys can do. The only time I griped to the friend of mine was it being a potential risk for him hurting himself holding the door open as he's got a bad back and knees and had to lunge for the door before I got to it... Other than instances like that, I love it!
I don't care for the PC of today's society. Sugar-coating everything because we're so afraid of offending anyone... If you had a "tough skin", you shouldn't let stuff offend you so easily. People are people..
Just 'cause I say "bless you" when you sneeze, doesn't mean I'm giving you God's Blessing... It's a courteous thing that came from that but has lost much of its meaning over the years... it's more an automatic response than anything these days. And not all who say it are automatically blessing you in God's name and so forth...
So am I. Within my means for helping someone out.. I've bought stuff for friends of mine who don't have the money and drove a four-hour round trip out of my way for a friend to enjoy the Star Wars movie as he couldn't see it on his own... Not to mention giving him a ride to a convention the first of the month, helping him cash a check as he doesn't have a bank account.
I don't care for rudeness both at work and when I'm out somewhere. Those kind of people get dirty looks and muttered comments that, at times, I care not if they overhear them.
I guess living in NYC gives you that kind of 'tude.
I AGREE THERE!! I prefer straight-up honesty any day over being decieved and lied to. Or stolen from! Nor do I like being trod upon like a pile of dirt either.
Strange conversation
While I was at the gym a little while ago a gentleman on the thread mill next to mine struck up a conversation about- of all things, courtesies.
His thought was that maturity has more to do with kindness and courtesy. Stupidly I said- “I know some pretty kind five year olds.” “Maturity has nothing to do with age,” he corrected in a teacher type tone.
He went on to explain that the more mature a person is the more likely they will be to understand other people and know how to deal with them in a polite and kind way (I am cutting this story way down- we talked for forty five minutes). The immature will not understand and thus be ruder (intentionally or non intentionally- which he made a fair point of during our talk).
I asked how he had come to this conclusion and he told me that he had a Masters in Psychology and a Bachelors in Sociology. There is some level of me that doubts that I would start this thread then have a guy with a pair of degrees step onto a thread mill next to me and start a conversation about this very subject. Seems a little- emm, I don’t know, strange, maybe?
Course stranger things have happened.
So what do you all think- any weight to this? Maturity makes for more courtesy people?
While I was at the gym a little while ago a gentleman on the thread mill next to mine struck up a conversation about- of all things, courtesies.
His thought was that maturity has more to do with kindness and courtesy. Stupidly I said- “I know some pretty kind five year olds.” “Maturity has nothing to do with age,” he corrected in a teacher type tone.
He went on to explain that the more mature a person is the more likely they will be to understand other people and know how to deal with them in a polite and kind way (I am cutting this story way down- we talked for forty five minutes). The immature will not understand and thus be ruder (intentionally or non intentionally- which he made a fair point of during our talk).
I asked how he had come to this conclusion and he told me that he had a Masters in Psychology and a Bachelors in Sociology. There is some level of me that doubts that I would start this thread then have a guy with a pair of degrees step onto a thread mill next to me and start a conversation about this very subject. Seems a little- emm, I don’t know, strange, maybe?
Course stranger things have happened.
So what do you all think- any weight to this? Maturity makes for more courtesy people?
Dagger75 said:
Well, I'm not so sure about the service industry thing. It's part of the service industry that you're supposed to give, well, good service. If somebody's so bored that they're rude to customers, they should really find another job.
I also don't get the whole thing with figuring that just because somebody's in the service industry, and is getting minimum wage, they shouldn't work hard. When I was in retail, many of the employees just didn't care. They weren't making much, and figured they'd do a job like they weren't making much. That's rude to the customers, and disrespectful to the coworkers who are actually trying to accomplish something.
At the same time, customers can be incredibly rude. I remember a few instances where rather rude shoppers berated staff, leaving them in tears, or on the verge of tears. In many of these cases, the customer was actually in the wrong in the first place, but were taking advantage of the fact that the employee couldn't really do anything, for fear of losing their job. Luckily, the last time I saw this happen, the manager on duty saw it happen, and told the customer to apologize, then kicked him out of the store, and said that if he ever returned, the police would be called.
My girlfriend and I went into a store in Quebec a few months ago. I'm bilingual, but she's English only. We split up, and she went into a clothing store. A saleswoman/salesgirl came up to offer assistance, in French only. My girlfriend pointed out she doesn't speak French, and instead of seeking another employee who spoke English, the woman just turned her back on her and walked away. That really, really annoys me, as I find it just ignorant.
I agree with the "being nice possibly getting one into trouble" thing. I remember in my last year in University, it was the 22nd or 23rd of December, right after exams finished. Local campus pub, one of the patrons, a student, starts getting rowdy. Owner tries to get him to leave, but is an old man, and the student wouldn't go. Another student got up to help the owner make the first guy leave.....and the first guy pulls a knife and stabs the student that was trying to help in the heart, and killed him. For trying to help an older shop-keeper. Two days before Christmas. I remember reading about it in the local paper..it was horribly sad.
During the ice storm back in '97, they were distributing generators to some of the older people in our community so they could have some power. And people were *stealing* them from people's homes and selling them off to the highest bidder.
Banshee
Stevelabny,
I guess it is you that I started this thread to talk about. I doubt that we would ever meet, or ever have so.... Should we pass on the side walk or in a bus, you look at me or I at you neither of us will know who we are looking at, you will snarl or stare blank faced and I forget that I saw you within a few minutes and move on.
A person that smiles, or nods to me stays in my mind a little longer, one that says "bless you," when I sneeze remains that slightly longer, and someone that gives up his seat to a little old lady or a pregnant woman- well I might thank them and or speak kindly of that person later.
Its my belief that immortality begins with being remembered. People that make an impact on your life remain with you well past their passing.
As far as blessing someone- I believe in God, in Heaven and Hell, but religion, nah thanks. The blessing is just a kindness, a thought of good health, an extension of hope for good health and long life, nothing more.
I think it would blow you all away on my views and my beliefs (religious, political, and otherwise). I started this thread to ask the question, to find out why. Steve has helped me and I think a few more to understand the mind of people I perceive as rude.
Thank you, Steve, that was very kind of you.
I guess it is you that I started this thread to talk about. I doubt that we would ever meet, or ever have so.... Should we pass on the side walk or in a bus, you look at me or I at you neither of us will know who we are looking at, you will snarl or stare blank faced and I forget that I saw you within a few minutes and move on.
A person that smiles, or nods to me stays in my mind a little longer, one that says "bless you," when I sneeze remains that slightly longer, and someone that gives up his seat to a little old lady or a pregnant woman- well I might thank them and or speak kindly of that person later.
Its my belief that immortality begins with being remembered. People that make an impact on your life remain with you well past their passing.
As far as blessing someone- I believe in God, in Heaven and Hell, but religion, nah thanks. The blessing is just a kindness, a thought of good health, an extension of hope for good health and long life, nothing more.
I think it would blow you all away on my views and my beliefs (religious, political, and otherwise). I started this thread to ask the question, to find out why. Steve has helped me and I think a few more to understand the mind of people I perceive as rude.
Thank you, Steve, that was very kind of you.
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