ready action vs silent still spell

[Drakken]

I think a big point of the mage casting while being observed by the readied archer depends on if the spell is targeted at the archer? Here are my "opinions" without book facts.

Considering all things are supposed to be simaltaneous, and they are broken into rounds merely for game playability, then readied means the archer goes when his defined criteria are met.

If the archer had even a 1/1000th of a second, and he noticed a spell effect starting "On Him", he would be able to release his arrow. Even a command word or psionics would have to enter someone's mind to effect them. And all the archer needs is the moment he senses something to react, before the thought is completed. That is kind of what Readied implies. And a spell might go off instantaneous, but I think readied means that before it completes it's effects, the archer could react. Technically the spell would start first, but the archer could react.

Maybe he can't sense the weave, but nothing says that magic has no visible characteristics. It's not an "invisible" quickened etc etc. Maybe it looks like the invisible "Predator" moving towards the archer, or displaces air, or glows & shimmers, who knows, it's a DM's call. That's the big thing, if there is any visible effect either mentally/visibly/audibly/etc the archer get's to go.

So, where in the books does it say spells are invisible? Let's throw this one back to prove spells are invisible instead of proving they are visible. Which means it's probably the DM's call again!

This is a cool discussion though!

 

[IceBear]

I'd say that spells aren't invisible (though I'm probably wrong ).

Why? Make a touch attack normally (without the feats and you draw an AoO). Make a touch attack with a touch spell and suddenly you don't. Why? I'm guessing the target sees a glow about your hand and that puts him on the defensive.

Still, spells like Charm Person and Suggestion are weakened if they aren't invisible.

Anyway, I don't know if spells are invisible or not as I've never seen one. Hmmmmm - maybe they ARE invisible as not having seen one could just mean they are invisible

IceBear

 

[Nail]

And off topic, I treat AoO like Hong.

And I treat Hong like an AoO.

Never can be too careful.

 

[Stalker0]

I'm of the opinion that the archer wouldn't get the shot. As icebear pointed out, who uses silent, stiled spells that often?

To me, readied for "he casts a spell" means looking for verbal or somatic gestures.

"But he has to concentrate, which provokes AOO!!" you say. Okay, make the mage do defensive casting. Now he doesn't provoke AOO, now he makes no outlandish gestures, so in my mind nothign for the archer to pick up.

 

[Sixchan]

Him concentraing doesn't so much provoke an AoO as much as indicate that he may be casting. Whether it's defensive or not, he still has to concentrate, and that can be seen, right?

 

[LokiDR]

I think a big point of the mage casting while being observed by the readied archer depends on if the spell is targeted at the archer? Here are my "opinions" without book facts.

Considering all things are supposed to be simaltaneous, and they are broken into rounds merely for game playability, then readied means the archer goes when his defined criteria are met.

If the archer had even a 1/1000th of a second, and he noticed a spell effect starting "On Him", he would be able to release his arrow. Even a command word or psionics would have to enter someone's mind to effect them. And all the archer needs is the moment he senses something to react, before the thought is completed. That is kind of what Readied implies. And a spell might go off instantaneous, but I think readied means that before it completes it's effects, the archer could react. Technically the spell would start first, but the archer could react.

Maybe he can't sense the weave, but nothing says that magic has no visible characteristics. It's not an "invisible" quickened etc etc. Maybe it looks like the invisible "Predator" moving towards the archer, or displaces air, or glows & shimmers, who knows, it's a DM's call. That's the big thing, if there is any visible effect either mentally/visibly/audibly/etc the archer get's to go.

So, where in the books does it say spells are invisible? Let's throw this one back to prove spells are invisible instead of proving they are visible. Which means it's probably the DM's call again!

This is a cool discussion though!

You are attempting to apply logic and common sense to a magic system in an RPG.

Logic+Magic+RPG=headache

This should have nothing to do with wether or not the archer is the target of the effect. No facing in D&D, and where a character is "paying attention" doesn't effect AoOs. Instantanous in a spell description means the spell effect is over in an instant. This says nothing about casting time.

The visible effects of several spells, notably evocation, are detailed in the rules. Most the enchantment school should be invisible, based on the sense motive check you must make to determine if a person is enchanted.

And, in general, I thought the begining of this thread was pretty silly.