Reasons why going down the Essentials line of thinking is a mistake !!!

[TerraDave]

Istar, not that I disagree with you...but less support for class X is a little tough to blame on essentials only.

I mean, if they stayed on the same route as before, and just kept adding more and more classes, you would probalby still have this problem.

 

[Tony Vargas]

Lots of very negative things are being said about Essentials on that thread.

 

[Plane Sailing]

If this turns into a thread about moderation on another thread it will get closed, OK?

However, if you want to discuss the pros and cons of essentials support for Warden or Thief or related topics, you could continue with that.

Thanks

 

[shamsael]

I don't mind some classes getting more support than others. Likewise, I don't mind some classes getting less support either.

 

[Dannager]

I see the same logic in "Essentials ruined 4e!" as in "Vampires ruined 4e!"

Which is to say: none.

 

[Jack99]

Maybe it's cause I am drunk, but has essentials ruined (or lessened) support for your Warden and your Thief?

I mean, I get the Warden issue (although Heroes of the Feywild might give ya a little something?), but Thief? It's an Essential class, without Essentials, there would be no thief at all.

 

[Tony Vargas]

Yeah, I don't get the Theif thing. The Thief has Ambush Trick and Tactical Trick. A Rogue that /always/ has CA has recieved all the support it'll ever need. If they gave the Mage Wish, they'd never have to support it again, either.

 

[cignus_pfaccari]

For thief (and rogue), I'd like to be able to do a decent 2h weapon without multiclassing to spiked chain (though that's nice, too).

But that's honestly not a big deal.

Brad

 

[blalien]

You know he's on to something because he added three exclamation points to the end.

 

[filthgrinder]

I think it's pretty weird that a series of books (well too books, I hardly think the DM's kit or tile sets are being referenced here) that ADDED options to the game, ruined it, by taking away options? They provided a couple of new builds of classes that fill the needs and wants of a certain play style.

So let's look at the two arguments, no support for Wardens, no support for the Thief (although technically, Essentials provides the only support for the thief, but we'll say he meant Rogue).

The Warden wasn't supposed by Psionic Power, Arcane Power, or Martial Power 2. Obviously, the Power Books were a mistake. It was supported by Primal Power though, but I think my point it there.

Next, the rogue. I just started playing in an Underdark campaign. I created a level 6 drow rogue. If anything, there is too much support for the rogue. Have you gone through all the choices there? There is tons and tons of stuff. In fact, they are mostly ALL good choices too. I found myself constantly going, "ooooh, I want both of these" when chosing powers. I don't need more choices.

And yes, a Thief is a rogue choice. It was one of the options I looked at while building my character. I decided against it, but I looked it over.

Also, as pointed out, I'd really like to know some ideas about how the Warden lacks support. I wonder what else you'd like to see the class do. What do you think it's weak in. Is it, "there are no good options at level 3?" or "All my level 3 powers are good, but I'd like 2 more good choices to pick from".