D&D General Requesting permission to have something cool

[Reynard]

It's much the same as I would do as a teacher. You encourage the quiet ones to speak up and share ideas, whist encouraging the more confident to do more listening.

Sure, but we don't always have to assume we are talking about new players. Experienced players have responsibilities at the table, too. And away from it, in fact. RTFM and pick character options that support your preferences.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Since This is a topic about permission isn't the question not about power but about options?

The Fighter class as to find in 5E is just increasing power.

Options come from subclasses.

And Martial subclass more or less ended after XGTE. There is no master swordsman who can chop a wooden or stone door down (or force with a magic weapon). No expert marchman class that can pin a foe's foot to the floor. No spearmaster that can skewer 3 guys on his pike then suplex them backwards with his 20 strength.

Well, you can't require a class ability to need a 20 Strength, but you're right, WotC clearly isn't interested in making those kind of subclasses (or believes their mostly newbie player base doesn't want them). You gotta go elsewhere. Think outside the bun, as it were.

 

[DEFCON 1]

Then, frankly, you haven't been paying attention. I know of no other way to say it. It was everywhere--even here.

I haven't been paying attention... or perhaps your disdain has actually colored your perception to make it look like your side of the discussion is much more prominent to you than it actually is?

But whatever the truth of the matter may be... (halfway between both of us, as is usually the case in convos like these)... so long as WotC does not agree with your take there's not a whole lot that is going to be done. So it doesn't matter where the truth falls between our perceptions of the past... WotC has their own perception and will act accordingly.

 

[Scribe]

Well, you can't require a class ability to need a 20 Strength, but you're right, WotC clearly isn't interested in making those kind of subclasses (or believes their mostly newbie player base doesn't want them). You gotta go elsewhere. Think outside the bun, as it were.

Almost as if they have found that many (most?) players do not have an allergic reaction to just calling extra power outside of 'reality' what it is, Magic, and leveraging it within the limited systems that edition already supports.

 

[Remathilis]

Yeah, that idea is, IMO, undeniably silly (though I'm sure someone will deny it). I guess I'm wondering what kind of D&D you're advocating for, and where the kind of design changes needed to make it would come from.

The changes I would make, Ceteris paribus, is I would change the fighter, rogue and barbarian to give them "magical" abilities on par with the monk or bloodhunter. I would make subclasses act as the origin of those powers or their focus of them. No PC would be mundane, champion fighters would be a thing of the past.

 

[Minigiant]

Well, you can't require a class ability to need a 20 Strength, but you're right, WotC clearly isn't interested in making those kind of subclasses (or believes their mostly newbie player base doesn't want them). You gotta go elsewhere. Think outside the bun, as it were.

3PPs ain't doing it either.

That's why we hare here.

Players have to ask the DM "hey can you allow this homebrew subclass I made" and getting No's

 

[Scribe]

3PPs ain't doing it either.

That's why we hare here.

Players have to ask the DM "hey can you allow this homebrew subclass I made" and getting No's

Why has nobody tapped into this seemingly deep and vast pool of potential money.

 

[Minigiant]

Why has nobody tapped into this seemingly deep and vast pool of potential money.

These arguments.

That's why.

 

[Micah Sweet]

The changes I would make, Ceteris paribus, is I would change the fighter, rogue and barbarian to give them "magical" abilities on par with the monk or bloodhunter. I would make subclasses act as the origin of those powers or their focus of them. No PC would be mundane, champion fighters would be a thing of the past.

I would love to see that game, but you have to admit it would be a fundamental change to the game's character, if not its mechanics overly. Would be a great 3pp alternative though.

 

[Micah Sweet]

3PPs ain't doing it either.

That's why we hare here.

Players have to ask the DM "hey can you allow this homebrew subclass I made" and getting No's

Level Up has plenty of "not obviously supernatural" classes and archetypes, so I have to disagree with you there.