Response to Psionics Nerf (Move from inappropriate placement in House Rules thread)

[irdeggman]

Correct me if I'm wrong (I don't know much about psionics), but if I'm understanding this isn't the psion similar to a wizard, only that the psion has the possibility to push the "I WIN" button in the first encounter every day?

Or similarly, suppose that a wizard has the ability called "Nova":
Nova (Su): A wizard may expend all his spells to instantly win an encounter. This ability may only be used if he has cast (almost) no spells this day.


Clearly, the wizard with the Nova ability is a lot more powerful than a normal wizard.

Not really.

Comparing a psion to a wizard even in principle is a misconception.

The closest comparison is between a sorcerer and a psion.

Both can spontaneously cast/manifest their spells/powers and don't have to memorize them, both have a limit to the number of spells/powers they can know, etc.

 

[Baby Samurai]

Which also means that if the DM throws an extremely powerful encounter their way or if they run into that 1 in 5 combat where dice rolls are almost all going against the PCs (or, both happens simultaneously), the spontaneous PCs have very few ways to "go to the well" and pull out the big guns, at least in their primary capabilities.

Instead, the party tends to die, just for some sense of balancing out the PC capabilities.

Not at all, it means they can contribute meaningfully to every encounter, instead of being reduced to a commoner with a crossbow because they used up their power points/spells for the day.

And obviously WotC realizes the travesty of a mockery of a sham the per day paradigm is, as a lot of their latest material seems to be leaning towards a per encounter system.

 

[Baby Samurai]

Now that indicates a more well thought out means of applying the D&D system's design to a specific gaming style and not a quick reaction to only adjust one thing.

Wow, thank you very much. I'm so used to people acting like the fabric of the universe will unravel if you adjust the magic/psionic system to a per encounter base.

And as you said, we have thought it out, because you always have to be mindful of ripple effects by changing parts of the system.

 

[SlagMortar]

Did you also limit spontaneous casters in the number of spell slots they can use too?

Wizards (and other non-sponatanous casters) don't have the same problem becasue they must fix the spells they know ahead of time and can't freely choose which spells to cast at a certain time so smart preparation is the key for them.

With a single (or very, very few) encounters per day psions come out on top but spontaneous casters are not far behind, especially at low to mid levels where the psion can't fully benefit from augmentation due to the limit on pp he can use on a given power.

I'm curious about this assertion. I don't understand why spontaneous casters do better than prepared casters in a single encounter. I think its the other way around because:
1. Spontaneous casters in all but the lower levels have more spells per day.
2. Prepared casters lose flexibility with each spell they cast while a spontaneous caster only loses flexibility when they exhaust all spells of their highest spell level.
3. Prepared casters have easier access to quicken so are more likely to cast multiple spells per round.

 

[KarinsDad]

Not at all, it means they can contribute meaningfully to every encounter,

They can do that with the rules as written. Nobody forces a player to play a Psion or Sorcerer like an idiot.

 

[KarinsDad]

I'm curious about this assertion. I don't understand why spontaneous casters do better than prepared casters in a single encounter. I think its the other way around because:
1. Spontaneous casters in all but the lower levels have more spells per day.
2. Prepared casters lose flexibility with each spell they cast while a spontaneous caster only loses flexibility when they exhaust all spells of their highest spell level.
3. Prepared casters have easier access to quicken so are more likely to cast multiple spells per round.

Spontaneous casters have easier access to spontaneous metamagic. This is the #1 most overlooked aspect of Bards, Sorcerers and Warlocks, but it is their greatest strength. Spontaneous metamagic not only gives them more flexibility, but it also allows them to "Nova at will" as well (e.g. "You want me to cast 4 Empowered Scorching Rays in a row? No problem. Oh, you meant 4 Empowered Fireballs in a row? No problem." ).

 

[Baby Samurai]

They can do that with the rules as written.

Not if the DM "dares" to throw one too many encounters at them that day…

 

[KarinsDad]

Not if the DM "dares" to throw one too many encounters at them that day…

That happens with your house rule as well.

 

[SlagMortar]

Spontaneous casters have easier access to spontaneous metamagic. This is the #1 most overlooked aspect of Bards, Sorcerers and Warlocks, but it is their greatest strength. Spontaneous metamagic not only gives them more flexibility, but it also allows them to "Nova at will" as well (e.g. "You want me to cast 4 Empowered Scorching Rays in a row? No problem. Oh, you meant 4 Empowered Fireballs in a row? No problem." ).

I completely agree and did not overlook that. A prepared caster can also cast all his high level slots on one encounter, and can do it more quickly if he has some quickened spells. How does that make spontaneous casters better off with one encounter per day than a prepared caster? Is it your opinion that it is "going nova" to cast 4 of the same high level spell in a row, but not "going nova" to cast 4 different high level spells in a row?

 

[Baby Samurai]

That happens with your house rule as well.

Not even, but I'm curious as to why you would think so.