RPG Illegal File Sharing Hurts the Hobby

[Krypter]

1, 2 and a smidgen of 5. Thanks, eyebeams.

 

[JRRNeiklot]

True.

And, as is the case with a lot of other forms of illegal activity, the activities of one's peers will have a substantial influence on many a person's ethics.

It shouldn't. If my neighbor steals, murders, kicks babies, and spits on old womem, and gets away with it, that's no sign that I would do the same. My ethics are MINE. I will not be influenced to do evil by the actions of others.

 

[JohnNephew]

> Guess you aren't familiar with squatters rights then?

I am, actually. I know that these things are legal in some countries.

For example, one does not want to buy vacation properties in some foreign countries, because someone else can move in when you're not there and say it's theirs, and get backed up by the courts. Other countries that with different real estate property rights get a lot of investment and tourism because of it. I think Brazil (strong squatter's rights) versus Costa Rica (strong property rights) are contrasting examples, though I'm not an expert in the field. Costa Rica, of course, has a booming tourist trade and all kinds of vacation condominiums owned by foreigners (and lots of locals who make a living providing related services, earning common area maintenance fees, etc.).

> Okay, I'll take your word for it that the hobby, in general, is in decline at the moment.
> Now, is there any evidence that piracy has anything to do with this?

I believe there is, but I realize that it cannot be the only cause (not by a long shot), there is no conclusive evidence as to the degree of piracy's influence. I discussed some limited and anecdotal evidence in an earlier post. Having said that, I think it is a fact of the landscape that has to be included in business strategies, including the basic strategy of whether or not RPGs are an area worth investing in and in what way (e.g., whether to invest in an especially piracy prone area like d20, versus an area where you can build a proprietary game with a greater sense of community/solidarity/loyalty among your fans). And I expect that as a feature of the landscape it will continue to grow.

All else being equal, I think it is wiser to invest in something that is not effectively subject to piracy than something that is.

-John Nephew
President, Atlas Games

 

[Numion]

Going back to the Metallica thing. A lot of people seem to have the idea that it is OK to steal from the successful groups "because they don't miss it." But piracy doesn't hurt Metallica. It hurts the people who work at the assembly plant putting the CDs together. It hurts the hundreds of people involved in the design and production of the CD. Metallica will make their money on sponsorships and tours. But the people who find themselves without a job because there is no demand for legitimate CDs will be affected.

Yeah, and sending e-mail instead of snailmail hurts the people making the envelopes, selling the stamps and carrying the mail. You should've sent your opinion via snailmail to a newspaper.

EDIT: My point is that whenever new technology makes old technology obsolete, those who work in the old technology will have to adjust. This is not what the music industry is doing - they're working tooth and nail to keep manufacturing pieces of plastic worth 10 cents and selling them for 20 dollars (or whatever CDs cost where you live).

 

[Flexor the Mighty!]

Me and my group pirates rpg books the old fashion way. We load up in a station wagon on Wedsday when the new stuff is sent to the local stores, then we pull along side the delivery truck and send a boarding party over to claim our booty. Yar!

 

[Banshee16]

I kind of agree with the article and kind of not. The problem is the definition of lost revenue. No matter what they believe, not every downloaded PDF of a book is a lost sale...in many cases, the company would have realized no revenue from that book, as the player never would have bought it anyways.

That having been said, the player is still getting use of the book.

However.......I know people that have switched exclusively to PDFs. I've reprimanded several friends about this...but there's a limit to how far I can go. They're friends, afterall. But it's frustrating to see them with CDs full of material, and to hear that they were never planning on buying the books anyways, because if they couldn't get them on PDF, they'd just borrow my copies of the books. If it was them borrowing a few PDFs, that's one thing, IMO.....but when it means someone's no longer supporting the industry at all, and have cut their purchases to $0.00? This is not a big industry with rich players in it. Many of the D20 companies are tiny, with small profit margins. I wonder sometimes how much (if any) of the "D20 bubble" is actually the "stolen PDF effect"

I'm not sure what the answer is. I'm very hesitant to give anyone the right to load viruses or tracking software into anything they put in my machine......like what Sony-BMG did, that is causing such a commotion lately.

Banshee

 

[gamecat]

SNIP

and doing things like aggregating and reprinting the OGC of other publishers, which could be done without paying again for the writing).

SNIP

-John Nephew
President, Atlas Games

What the hell is that? Reprinting other people's work all while decrying copying of yours?

That's rich.

 

[Aus_Snow]

It shouldn't. If my neighbor steals, murders, kicks babies, and spits on old womem, and gets away with it, that's no sign that I would do the same. My ethics are MINE. I will not be influenced to do evil by the actions of others.

Oh dear.

Now, when you say "it shouldn't", do you mean "it wouldn't"? Or do you literally mean what you typed? Please, clarify. There's a world of difference there.

That's quite aside from the rather obviously over-the-top and flailing um. . . rebuttal (?).

Since when did acts such as murdering, kicking babies, etc. enter into this? Well, apart from just then of course. Strikes me as a woefully ineffective attempt at diversion.

Hm, anyway. Peer influence is a real and powerful thing. If you believe it not to be, in some broad and real sense (i.e., other than simply pertaining to you, in reality or otherwise), feel free to explain how and why this might hold true in whichever universe you prefer, bearing in mind that pulling out irrelevant extremes is not likely to be of much utility in that process.

 

[kingpaul]

What the hell is that? Reprinting other people's work all while decrying copying of yours?

That's rich.

I believe John was talking about ways to reduce their expenses when publishing books; one of which would be bundling OGC since the material is already out there.

Now, unless the entire book is declared OGC, then distributing the entire book is a violation of copyright. I can't recall any book that has had its artwork, layout, text, et al declared OGC.

 

[JohnNephew]

What the hell is that? Reprinting other people's work all while decrying copying of yours?

That's rich.

I'm not sure if you're accusing me of hypocrisy or speaking about d20 publishers in general.

There was a time when the big trend was for publishers to aggregate and republish big collections of existing OGC from many publishers. We did not do this. However, we could see the obvious benefits to those who did -- namely, being able to sell big, thick books without having to pay for any of the writing.

I should note that anything we (or anyone else) released as OGC can be reproduced freely, by anyone who follows the modest requirements of the OGL. Pirates, however, don't do that; they reproduce entire books, not just the OGC, and do not follow the OGL. As long as they followed the terms of the OGL, the people doing those aggregated works were doing nothing illegal nor unethical; they were doing something that anyone who understood the OGL expected would happen sooner or later.