Scarred Lands: Ask the Sage (Going into Triple OT Folk!)

[cats_claw]

Chaotic Monks

Does anyone know about any chaotic orders for monks on Ghelspad? I have a player that is a CG/CN monk, she is starting in Hollowfaust, and she is a traveller and information seeker for the Necromancers' Soverign Council.

I wanted to make her a part of an existing order, if one exists, otherwise I would create a monasitc order for Hollofaust: The Order of the Eternal Cycle. It is travelling order, like the Veshian Vigils, but working to gather wisdom and send word of the lands back to the Guilds in Hollowfaust.

Has anyone played a chaotic monk or known someone that has? I imagine this monk will be disciplined in her body and her focus, but live as independent and not bound to a strict body of rules. The only truly predictable thing is the nature of the Eternal Cycle.

Anyway.... thoughts anyone?

catsclaw

 

[Nightfall]

Last I checked monks couldn't be chaotic. Now if you wanted say a monk/wizard or maybe a monk/cleric of Nemorga, I could see that. But he'd have to be lawful for it to work. That's the requirements of the class. He/she could go monk a few levels and then switch to another core class and then change alignments. It's entirely possible.

 

[cats_claw]

Last I checked monks couldn't be chaotic. Now if you wanted say a monk/wizard or maybe a monk/cleric of Nemorga, I could see that. But he'd have to be lawful for it to work. That's the requirements of the class. He/she could go monk a few levels and then switch to another core class and then change alignments. It's entirely possible.

I agree, according to the PH -- but I think I saw something somewhere were there was a particular society of monks (not in Scarred Lands content) where there were chaotic monks. If I can only find out where and for what campaign world.... I'm trying to see how I can make it work and justify it at the same time. It's something that the player really wants to do.

catsclaw

 

[Nightfall]

The only chaotic type monks I can recall were the elven monks of the Southsea Realm. To my knowledge they are still lawful even with a chaotic god.

I'd say just create a new core class that uses monk powers but isn't a monk. Or better still, use Oathsworn.

 

[eryndel]

Not particularly Scarred Lands but the githzerai have monks and they are CN IIRC. I'm not sure if they break the rules because of there nature or there monks aren't really chaotic though the race is.

Maybe that's what you're thinking of?

Werner

 

[Nightfall]

You're mixing races Werner. Gith-YANKI are chaotic. Githzerai are lawful. They (Githzerai) live in Limbo, complete chaos.

 

[eryndel]

Sorry Nightfall, but I don't get your logic. The Githzerai live in Limbo, so I'm not sure how that makes them lawful. The Githyanki live in the Astral and IIRC they are CE. But, you're going to make me go up and get my book.

...

Githzerai are any neutral and Githyanki are usually evil (any). I could have sworn the GithZ were CN but that might be hearkening back to their Fiend Folio days (the last time I actually used them in a game.)

 

[Nightfall]

My logic is off I admit. And you're right.

 

[Zelda Themelin]

Sorry Nightfall, but I don't get your logic. The Githzerai live in Limbo, so I'm not sure how that makes them lawful. The Githyanki live in the Astral and IIRC they are CE. But, you're going to make me go up and get my book.

...

Githzerai are any neutral and Githyanki are usually evil (any). I could have sworn the GithZ were CN but that might be hearkening back to their Fiend Folio days (the last time I actually used them in a game.)

Githzerai race including their monks used to be chaotic neutral during first edition AD&D. However, second edition made them lawful neutral race, but decided they still lived in Limbo.

Third edition Manual of the Planes actually claims they are lawful neutral monks living in Limbo, and that "Strongly chaos-aligned trait of Limbo is neutralized by the walls of githzerai monasteries." Yeh, right. But that what book claims if you want it according to rules.

I won't, but whatever.

There is no reason whey there coudn't be chaotic monks with multitude of prestige classes there are around. Those have broken PHB-expections before. So you woudn't be doing anything someone hasn't done before.
They just perhaps woudn't be called monks to avoid confusion of getting mixed with Corean's or Hedrada's orders.

 

[Trickstergod]

Faith comes before the secular in my opinion.

The Termana hardcover doesn't make mention of whether or not That Which Abides monks who can multi-class freely as clerics are Lawful or Chaotic, but my opinion is following your gods tenets comes before anything of this mortal world. And having faith enough to call upon the power of a dead god only makes them more likely to be Chaotic.

The Termana hardcover doesn't specify, but by all reason, there are Chaotic forsaken elf cleric/monks.

Furthermore, Ontenazu seems to have a monk tradition going for it, yet are devout Enkilites. As such, again - nothing specifically stated, but Chaotic Ontenazu Enkili worshipping monks makes sense here.

Especially considering the associations with the wind that various martial arts traditions have and, therefore, monks. So it follows suit that there'd be some wind-based, Enkili worshipping monks.

As there's Lawful bards in the Scarred Lands, there's every likelihood of Chaotic monks in the setting, too - they're already implied to exist. But only implied.

Not to mention, you can be disciplined and Chaotic at the same time, depending on how you define Chaos in the context of alignment.

And to pipe in with Eryndel, githzerai are all kinds of Chaotic. Even with the iresome changes made to them in 3rd edition, they're alignment tendency is just listed as being neutral on the good to evil access, and varied on the law to chaos one. Before third, they were Chaotic Neutral. There's a reason some are called anarchs, and it ain't because the race has a tendency for Lawfulness - being enslaved and breaking free tends to create a rebellious streak.

Then again, 3rd also changed a previous Intelligence bonus into an Intelligence negative, as another bit of ire I have towards Wizards...I mean, they're supposed to have a tendency to being multi-classed fighter/wizards...yet they have an Intelligence negative?

Bah. Bah! Iresome.

Anyway, Cats Claw, Chaotic monks in the Scarred Lands, as I previously mentioned, are implied.

I will add, however, that a Chaotic order of monks in Hollowfaust makes little sense. The city is extremely lawful. That anything chaotic would spring up in it would be rather peculiar. I don't allow monks really at all unless it's in a bit more Asiatic themed setting than the Scarred Lands currently qualifies for, but were I, I would allow Chaotic monks under the right circumstances, but definitely wouldn't have any orders of them that were in anyway related to Hollowfaust.