Sense Motive

[KingCrab]

It says in the players guide that sense motive can be used to avoid being bluffed. How does this work when multiple things are being asked, or even worse, the same thing is being asked multiple times. Can a player who is questioning an NPC ask the same question several times forcing an opposing check over and over until the lie is detected? Do you only allow one roll every so often? If so, how often?

One of my players is playing a rather inquisitive character and I want to make sure the skill isn't abused.

 

[lottrbacchus]

Maybe once per encounter? By asking over and over again, the answer isn't going to change and neither is the motivation. Perhaps the only thing that will change is that the NPCs mood will get worse and worse.

 

[TheGogmagog]

Interesting dilemma. I would think that one check per lie would be sufficient, regardless of how many the questions are asked. Though on the other hand that is one of the key things with interrogation. Ask variations of the same question over a fatiguing span of time (and letting their throughout get dry, or bladder full). Then compare the answers for inconsistencies.

The secondary issue... So you've detected something isn't right (successful sense motive). What part of the story is the lie might not be obvious. Even more critical, the real truth isn't revealed.

I also believe that most credible authorities agree that torture does not reveal credible information. Ulpian: "The strong will resist and the weak will say anything to end the pain."

On the whole how effective sense motive is, is up to the DM. You should reward the players some, probably just a little more than you would really like to give away. Something like the BBEG occasionally uses invisibility, so the group knows to prepare against such. Or just lead them along the plot, "Not all is as it seems and it has someting to do with that warehouse, I've never been allowed in there, so I don't know what's really up."

 

[blargney the second]

Sense Motive is my favourite skill. The trick is to ask lots of pointed questions and refrain from rolling the check until you've got enough circumstance bonuses that you're very likely to succeed. I'd never pester the DM for more than a single roll.

 

[Erywin]

To build on what Blarg said, as I am his DM when he is playing. I try to Role-play out social interactions rather than defaulting to dice rolls. If the NPC has a low bluff check and he is trying to hide something, I make it fairly obvious that he is lying. But, if on the other hand the NPC has a high bluff check I can usually lie through my teeth and the players won't realize it to even ask for a roll But if a roll is asked for, the NPC has a high enough check to keep the players guessing

Cheers,
E

 

[jimpaladin]

@KingCrab

I would allow a dfferent roll for each different subject that the player asks about. Also as others have said, you learn that he is holding something back and you may or may not let the player know.

By subject I mean if you are asking about the BBEG then "anything" that has to do with the BBEG is one subject. You get one roll when you allow the player to decide he wants that roll. I'm not explaining this well

If the player ask about the area surround the town that is one subject. If the player asks about the area around the BBEG hideout EVEN THOUGH IT IS THE SAME AREA more or less is a subject tied to the BBEG and so is part of that one chance to see the difference in the story(ies).

hope that made sense, if not I'll try after sleep

 

[Pickaxe]

Sense Motive (Wis)

[snip]

Try Again

No, though you may make a Sense Motive check for each Bluff check made against you.

If the player is literally asking the same questions over and over, the NPC is presumably providing the same answers each time. IMO, the repeated answers would not constitute a new attempt to Bluff. If the player asks new questions (not just rephrasing the old ones), especially if the questions presented evidence that the NPC had failed to explain before, the NPC would need to provide new answers and therefore (if he was lying) would be attempting a new Bluff.

--Axe

 

[AnonymousOne]

A failed Sense Motive roll is most often followed by a monstrous Intimidate roll by our party tank....

 

[RigaMortus2]

It says in the players guide that sense motive can be used to avoid being bluffed. How does this work when multiple things are being asked, or even worse, the same thing is being asked multiple times. Can a player who is questioning an NPC ask the same question several times forcing an opposing check over and over until the lie is detected? Do you only allow one roll every so often? If so, how often?

One of my players is playing a rather inquisitive character and I want to make sure the skill isn't abused.

If the Bluff check is successful, then the character beleives what the bluffer wants them to beleive. So there would be no reason to ask the same question over and over again because (a) the answer would be the same and (b) you believe him already. A player wanting to ask the same question over and over again, when he already believes the target's answer, is going into metagame territory IMO.