Shadowrun: How can they properly use Native Americans?

[MGibster]

CP 2020 was an interest of my, but I never got a group to try it.

I always felt that game art gave SR a great deal of its attraction.

You're not wrong. The black & white art was pretty awesome in and of itself, but color pages outside of AD&D wasn't something most of us were used to. Then there's the iconic cover by Elmore that seems so cheesy today but was totally radical in 1989.

 

[Ralif Redhammer]

At the time, I just thought it was completely unrealistic the Confederacy could have achieved victory. I could accept undead gunslingers, mad scientists with flame throwers, Baptist preachers performing miracles, and even Buffalo Soldiers using steam powered jetpacks, but I could not accept not being crushed by the Union.

Yeah, even tweaking a few things, a victory by the Confederacy just wasn't going to happen. The greater industrialization of the North was always going to tell.

I had a similar problem with Shadowrun. Native Americans make up about 2% of the population. I don't care if they've got magic, I don't buy them beating the US government, or at the very least, having that victory last.

The Great Ghost Dance is that it caused four volcanoes to erupt at once. Magic had only been around for six years at this point. The scale of devastation would've been unlike anything seen before, from a power that people probably didn't understand. Yes, the US government could've kept fighting - they had the military superiority. But it probably would've proven an unpopular war, and they had no idea what NAN could've followed that up with.

 

[Umbran]

The Great Ghost Dance is that it caused four volcanoes to erupt at once. Magic had only been around for six years at this point. The scale of devastation would've been unlike anything seen before, from a power that people probably didn't understand. Yes, the US government could've kept fighting - they had the military superiority. But it probably would've proven an unpopular war, and they had no idea what NAN could've followed that up with.

The Great Ghost Dance can be seen as analogous to dropping a nuke that nobody knew they had, and not knowing if they had another one.

 

[Jd Smith1]

Yeah, even tweaking a few things, a victory by the Confederacy just wasn't going to happen. The greater industrialization of the North was always going to tell.

Not to mention the degree of infrastructure. The South's rail system was haphazard and insufficient, geared primarily for the movement of ag goods..

Winfield Scott anticipated the route to victory; it was his original plan, which he put in motion in 1861, that broke the CSA: naval blockade, port seizure, and securing the Mississippi.

If you remove Lee from the history, the South would have gone under by '63. If the AoP had competent leadership during the Peninsular Campaign, the war could have been over in '62. Or at least Richmond would have been taken.

The only real hope the CSA ever had was foreign intervention, but that would have required divesting themselves of the institution of slavery.

 

[Bill Zebub]

Changing the thread title to say "represent" instead of "use" might be a start...

 

[kigmatzomat]

The Great Ghost Dance can be seen as analogous to dropping a nuke that nobody knew they had, and not knowing if they had another one.

From memory they dropped 2 nukes plus artillery.

The "artillery" was when the re-education camp fences blew down and all the guards' weaponry bounced off.

Nuke #1 was when a large military force, including aircraft, was destroyed by tornados and other freak weather.

Nuke #2 was blowing 4 volcanos at once.

Nuke #3.... set off the Virginia & Ranapo Fault lines on the east coast? Trigger the New Madrid fault in the midwest? Blow the mega volcano under Yellowstone?

 

[Umbran]

From memory they dropped 2 nukes plus artillery.

I don't think quibbling over the details adds much to the point.

 

[Anon Adderlan]

At the time, I just thought it was completely unrealistic the Confederacy could have achieved victory. I could accept undead gunslingers, mad scientists with flame throwers, Baptist preachers performing miracles, and even Buffalo Soldiers using steam powered jetpacks, but I could not accept not being crushed by the Union. I had a similar problem with Shadowrun. Native Americans make up about 2% of the population. I don't care if they've got magic, I don't buy them beating the US government, or at the very least, having that victory last.

You'd be surprised at what 2% of the population can do. Power is funny like that.

William Gibson said "When I see things like Shadowrun, the only negative I feel about it is the initial extreme revulsion at seeing my literary DNA mixed with elves."

#LiteralLiteralRacialPurity

I jest, but his lack of vision here is both surprising and disappointing, as there's all sorts of commentary a virus which changes your abilities and social class makes possible.

 

[Bill Zebub]

You'd be surprised at what 2% of the population can do. Power is funny like that.


#LiteralLiteralRacialPurity

I jest, but his lack of vision here is both surprising and disappointing, as there's all sorts of commentary a virus which changes your abilities and social class makes possible.

I don't think that needs to be dismissed as "lack of vision". He may simply dislike fantasy as a genre. I feel that way about mixing tech into my own fantasy, whether it's fiction or RPGs.

 

[shirleyishmael]

I still love Shadowrun 2E. I have always been interested in the current editions but have never picked one up. The eliminations of the Native concept would make me sad as I think they were a large part of the setting that created a way to bring certain elements into the setting and I thought that it was a cool idea.
I know it would be a lot to do but one could actually talk to some tribe members and ask their take on it.