Shadowrun: sell it to me!

[Tsyr]

Also, if you havn't found it yet, a good general link is http://www.shadowrunrpg.com/

 

[Shalimar]

wow Shalmar, that's good. My group will kill NPC's but not often. There are just some locations you just can't bypass without killing someone, and there have been a few occasions when things have gone horribly wrong (bad dice rolls, bad timeing, anything is possible) and they've had to blast there way out. Now out of sheer morbid curiosity are you saying that they never confront anyone or that they just use non lethal weapons? After all there are many non lethal and very effictive ways to deal with opponants in SR.

It was through planning, we avoid as much confrontation as is humanly possible, we plan our runs down to the second leaving the barest minimum to chance that is allowable. We have a saying "The moment we roll the dice is the moment we lose." and yes some things absolutely NEED dice rolling, but everything else like combat is avoidable, you have to understand that any time you roll the dice things can go wrong, so miniming neccessary dice rolls, and minimizing the consequences of failed dice rolls is one of the most important things in a run.

Don't get me wrong, our team if we chose could probably go in shooting and still succeed, but the possibility of loosing a character would be heightened humongously (only one character has actually died, and it had nothing to do with a run). Our group consists of an Elven Racoon Shaman specializing in illusions, a pair of Elf Street Samurai who handle Breaking and entry and the long gun, A troll Psy-ad who specializes in heavy weapons and driving, and finally a human Decker. Between these five we could easily put down the Red Samurai, the Seraphim, or any of the elite units publised in the modules, we have clashed with them and come away none the worse for it, but only because we stuck to our plan.

We generally each carry the rubber bullets presented in the main book, but we also each carry a clip loaded with armor piercing bullets for drones, or if its absolutely to put someone down, we use the called shot rule and put a few in their legs. Of course you can't get warheads for the trolls rocket launcher that do stun, but we have yet to use the rocket launcher for anything but to create a backdoor out, and even then, shaped charges are more effective and much more oftern used.

 

[Orias]

Yes, well, the problem with the system of Mage (and, as I understand it Ars Magica, though I've never seen it personally), is that it needs a GM with a bright mind and an iron hand - the system is wonderfully flexible, but also woefully abuseable.

The Mage system is simple in concept, but complex in the details of application. Shadowrun has it beat in that sense - it's simple in concept and simple in the details of application as well.

I will agree that Shadowrun has a better magic system than Mage if you want people who want an easy-to-run, very simple, very defined magic system.

The magic in Shadowrun is easy to learn, cool to use, & extremely cinematic.

As for logic, metaphysics, & a game where you actually need to understand philosophy to play - Mage is by far the best magic system, but unfortunately the most complicated among people who don't play the game regually. Particually when you begin dealing with the complications between Spirit & Prime magic. The further metaphysically out you get, the more & more confusing the concepts begin.

That being said, Mage is probably my favorite game out there.

 

[Mercule]

Well, people have covered things quite nicely. About the only thing I have to add is that I absolutely hate technomagic, technology mixed with magic, or magic thrown into technology.

Shadowrun is the exception. They got the mix right. Absolutely awesome game. One of my favorites.

 

[dropshadow]

ooops...

Not much to add here, I too love Shadowrun. So I will just post a cool story I saw on the dumpshock forums the other day.

Originally posted on the dumpshock forums
Ever had an oops moment as a DM? You try to pull something new, the characters do this and this and something unexpected and drastic happens?

-----Example-------
Enter an enemy magician. To throw the players off guard I give him a unique spell. It's an illusion spell similar to agony. However as an added effect the spell creates the illusion to the target and anyone watching that the target is suffering a gruesome death.

(this happened a few years ago, so the account may not be entirely accurate)
--------------------

GM : (Player 1) screams in pain. He falls to the ground thrashing. Blood starts to flow from multiple wounds on his body.

(Player 1): Damn it! Someone get my character a truama patch!

GM : You're not there yet. You've taken a serious wound and are paralyzed by pain.

(Player 2): I'll get the bastard!

( Attempts to shoot magician, but another sustained illusion spell makes the magician appear to be standing 3 meters from where he actually is. Bullets appear to fly right through him. )

GM : The magician flees through the doorway. (Player 1) continues to scream in agony. His eyes burst. Blood flows from his mouth and ears.

(Player 1): Oh yuck. What sort of freaky ( oh allright he used a different adjective then freaky ) spell is this?

(Player 2): I put two bullets in (Player 1)'s head and put him out of his misery.

GM : ( Speechless )

 

[Tsyr]

Re: Re: Shadowrun: sell it to me!

I never much cared for it, but that's just me. I think a better Shadowrun than Shadowrun would be to just use D20Modern, and maybe ebay for Cyberpunk rulebook, from which I'd steal the hacking rules and a bunch of atmosphere.

That would depend on if you want Shadowrun, or generic cyber-punk trappings with elves.

I'm an avid supporter of D20. I love it. But I'm also one of the people who firmly believes it is NOT a D20 game, and never should be.

*edit*

It's also worth nothing that, while Shadowrun is cyberpunk, Cyberpunk the game has a very different feel from Shadowrun.

 

[Voadam]

I've heard some good things about Shadowrun, but honestly know very little about it. From what I've heard it sounds like "high fantasy meets cyberpunk in the near future" - which sounds pretty good to me. Am I right about that? Is it any good? What's the system like? (I hear tell of many d6s.)

So come sell it to me. Alternatively, tell me why it's rubbish and I shouldn't buy it, depending on what you actually think.

I'm a diehard d20 girl but I'm willing to try other systems and this sounded good.

So should I spend my money?

Good points:

The setting, megacorps, splintered governments, returned magic, cyberware, high ethnic/cultural aspects, good game attitude, cool lingo.

Magic: cool concepts, astral space is well developed and useable, mages vs shamans and mana concepts. Ability to repeatedly cast at will is great.

xp system, develops specific aspects of the character instead of levels, rewards for thinking and roleplaying, not killing things.

chargen, archetype for quick classes, or well balanced in depth development system based on priorities and choices.

Cons,

Astral and computer adventures strand everybody but the mage and deckers, I've sat around bodyguarding bodies too many times.

Dice system, even after playing for years I never fully figured it out.

It is a good fun game if you can get a handle on the mechanics.

 

[Wombat]

Hmmm, the Shadowrun setting always struck me, especially after playing a few sessions and hearing about a lot more of them as "...all that an' a bowl of grits." In other words, it was fantasy, and it was cyberpunk, and it was Native American Lore, and it was gritty, and it was High Special Effects Summer Blockbuster, and...

Then there was the "buckets o' dice" syndrome, which could only be matched in sheer amounts by a high power Champions game, but the dice system made less sense.

I prefer more focused genres. This one felt more like "Wouldn't it be cool if we used all the GURPS supplements at once?"

Then again, I knew and still know people who have had and continue to have a great time with it. So it all boils down to personal tastes.

 

[Orias]

I still stand by the belief that Shadowrun has the best gun-combat system ever created, & may remain that was for a long, long time.

Shadowrun's world is, unfortunately, extremely cluttered with psuedo-metaplot & various settings. The main storyline is very interesting, but becomes extremely confusing when dealing with anything but the Western-most U.S., Seattle, or a couple places in Europe (although they have a tendancy to be at war much more than the other countries). If you just play in Seattle, you won't have a hard time picking up the culture of the game in a very fluid, easy, & cool style. If you want your characters to travel to the middle of Colorado, then to Chicago, then fly out to Siberia, you are going to be "suppliment" jumping like hell.

 

[Vocenoctum]

The cousin just stayed on top of the building unnoticed the entire firefight.

Grrrr...

That seems really bad... until you read that other thread about bad players.

So, the cousin didn't abduct and rape the guy. You therefor can't really complain too much, eh?

It's just perspective!