Shifting whilst prone

[Diplomat123]

I am trying to get my head round how this should work.

As per PHB if i am prone i can take a move action and move up to half my speed.

Alternatively shift is a valid move action where i simply move to an adjacent space without provoking opportunity attacks.

Both of these appear in the same section of the PHB, neither refers directly to the other, so neither is obviously the specific trumping the general rule.

So my question. If i am prone, can i shift to an adjacent space as i have a move allowance of half my normal speed, and can always shift one.

Or, if i am prone i cannot shift to an adjacent space because i only have half my normal movement, giving me a shift of half which gets me nowhere.

As a supplemental question, i have a number of powers allowing me to shift multiple squares, and am an Elf so ignore difficult terrain. Would this change anyone's answer?

 

[Mesh Hong]

I do not allow shifting while prone. My reasoning is that shifting is a careful and defensive movement, when you are prone you grant combat advantage against all enemies which represents the fact that you cannot properly defend yourself. Therefore you cannot shift and must move.

On the second point, you can attack from prone (with a -2 penalty) but I rule that any shift action granted from the use of the power is not possible.

 

[babinro]

The rules don't allow shifting while prone as per my understanding.
When prone you can either stand, or crawl as your move actions.
Crawling being half your movement and provoking attacks.

The secondary question would not allow for shifting, same kind of circumstance as though you use shifting powers while immobilized or restrained.

On a side note, if you allowed shifting while prone, it would simply further weaken powers that push/knock prone. Something that should greatly hinder those characters who do not have any ranged attacks.

 

[Davachido]

First off in the shifting says:

Movement: Move 1 square.

Which means you must be able to move while prone, which you can't as shown by prone:

You can’t move from your space, although you can teleport, crawl, or be forced to move by a pull, a push, or a slide.

So you can not shift while prone even if you are an elf since you must be able to move normally to do that.

On a side note there is one way to shift while prone that I can think of, the property of floorfighter straps:

Property: While you are prone, you do not grant combat advantage and you can shift. When you stand up, you can shift 1 square as part of the same action.

 

[rayous]

there is a feat in players handbook 3 that gives you the ability to shift while prone.

 

[Droogie128]

Shift, crawl, and stand up are 3 seperate move actions. The only move actions you are allowed while prone are stand up or crawl, not shift.

 

[Mort_Q]

Shift, crawl, and stand up are 3 seperate move actions. The only move actions you are allowed while prone are stand up or crawl, not shift.

There is one caveat; if the space you are in is occupied, and you want to stand.

Occupied Space: If your space is occupied by another creature, you can shift 1 square, as part of this move action, to stand up in an adjacent unoccupied space. If your space and all adjacent squares are occupied by other creatures, you can’t stand up.

 

[Diplomat123]

This is the clearest consensus i have ever seen in one of these threads, so you guys must be getting your info from somewhere. But for the life of me i can't see anything under shift that says it doesn't work when prone, and nothing under prone that says shifting isn't allowed.

Could someone point me at a specific rule.

Cheers.

 

[Davachido]

Like I highlighted in my post above, it doesn't explicitly state "You can not shift" in the prone section, it says you may not move. It then proceeds to list the movement type you can do as shown by the exact wording below:

• You grant combat advantage to enemies making melee attacks against you.
• You can’t move from your space, although you can teleport, crawl, or be forced to move by a pull, a push, or a slide.
• You get a +2 bonus to all defenses against ranged attacks from nonadjacent enemies.
• You’re lying on the ground. (If you’re flying, you safely descend a distance equal to your fly speed. If you don’t reach the ground, you fall.)
• You take a -2 penalty to attack rolls.
• You can drop prone as a minor action.

Shifting requires you to be able to move 1 square, per the normal movement rules as below. Since prone says you may not move except by crawling, the specific overrides the general and therefore you can't shift.

SHIFT: MOVE ACTION

Movement: Move 1 square.

No Opportunity Attacks: Your movement doesn’t provoke opportunity attacks.

Difficult Terrain: Because each square of difficult terrain costs 1 extra square to enter, you can’t normally shift into a square of difficult terrain, unless you’re able to shift multiple squares or you’re able to ignore the effects of difficult terrain.

Special Movement Modes: You can’t shift when using a form of movement that requires a skill check. For example, if you’re climbing or swimming, you can’t shift if you would need to make an Athletics check to use that kind of movement. You might find it useful to first shift away from an adjacent enemy, then walk or run.

If you crawl for example:

CRAWL: MOVE ACTION

Prone: You must be prone to crawl.

Movement: Move up to half your speed.

Provoke Opportunity Attacks: If you leave a square adjacent to an enemy, that enemy can make an opportunity attack against you.

They are in the PHB, can't remember the page numbers off hand but most of us usually refer to the compendium on the wizards site as that takes into account errata and what not. (The above are all from the compendium)

The fact that they have made a specific item/feat to let you shift while prone should help our argument as well that you can't shift while prone otherwise, what's the point of that item/feat?

 

[Amphimir Míriel]

How about when you are granted a shift by an ally?

This came up in our last session, one of the characters was prone and another character used a power that granted an ally with a shift. He decided to give it to the prone character.

I was in doubt, but in the best intention to not say "no", as an interim ruling I allowed the prone character to use the shift to stand up (but not move anywhere)

Ideas?