D&D 5E Should 5E have Healing Surges?

[JRRNeiklot]

I think most people who dislike healing surges probably also dislike wands of healing.

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

It doesn't seem quite the same to me Steve because there's no real LIMIT to a 3e party's healing resources. Sure, there's a sort of soft limit, but there's little reason to actually RATION how many wands of CLW you make. You could make 500 of them and eventually you'll use them up. There's not a lot of reason NOT to just push any and all extra treasure the party has that they aren't using for anything else today into healing wands/potions/whatever. They're nearly as fungible as gold anyway. Heck, healsticks would make a pretty decent currency for larger transactions, gold after all in D&D seems to exist in near infinite quantities and is likely to show up in big wads of treasure now and then. Healsticks have actual utility!

Beyond that though I can't imagine anyone considering HS to be 'gamist' in this sort of environment. Nothing ever felt more gamist to me than healbots and their paraphernalia.

HS worked fine, really. I agree, it seems like players hate transparent mechanics, but that makes me sad because transparent mechanics on the DM-side are exactly the right way to go. I have no desire to RUN an obtuse system ever again.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I think most people who dislike healing surges probably also dislike wands of healing.

Personally, I like HSes only as an extremely limited resource- more limited than APs- but am neutral on Wands. Then again, nobody in our group ever plays a crafter caster, making Wands a treasure, not a piece of ubiquitous kitsch.

Beyond that though I can't imagine anyone considering HS to be 'gamist' in this sort of environment. Nothing ever felt more gamist to me than healbots and their paraphernalia.

Well, HS are baked into each PC from the get-go, whereas in prior editions, increasing the party's healing beyond the capacity of the divine casters' personal resources is entirely optional. Right now, my Sorc/Clc/MT/Geomancer is the healingest healer we've had in our group's history...and it isn't because of his domains (Earth and Plants) or his gear (he has no healing gear*), but because he's using the CompDiv feat Sacred Healing to burn Turn Undead uses to grant Fast Healing in an AoE. When the PCs and chosen NPCs draw close, they all feel his healing power. Thus, he barely ever burns a spell for healing purposes...but this means he's a Lord of the Uttercrap when it comes to actually Turning Undead.













* at some point, I plan on taking Brew Potion so that I can emulate Swamp Thing's healing tubers, grown from the substance of his planty body...

 

[SteveC]

I think most people who dislike healing surges probably also dislike wands of healing.

That may be so, but then the healing surge mechanic basically reverts to how many cure spells you have at that point. The mechanic is still there, it's just lessened. In the old days, the SSI Gold Box games had this mechanic where you could rest until healed: it would convert all of your spells to cures and then use them until your group was completely healed. You could spend weeks in a dungeon that way. At the end of the day hit points have to come back, and the mechanic you use to measure how that happens are the surge mechanic.

 

[Gort]

I disagree with attrition-based D&D - I want to be able to have five fights a day, or one fight a day, with each having equal danger and challenge.

I'd like to see all resources like daily spells (and this includes vancian magic) and daily healing surges go away, but I'd be fine with them remaining as encounter resources - you can be healed three times per fight if you're a fighter, for instance.

 

[javgoro]

I will like for them to be in, as long as they don't stop other sources of healing (i. e. in 4E, once you were out of surges, you couldn't be healed. This felt completely counterintuitive).

 

[FireLance]

I will like for them to be in, as long as they don't stop other sources of healing (i. e. in 4E, once you were out of surges, you couldn't be healed. This felt completely counterintuitive).

Rather, powers that allow you to heal without spending healing surges exist, but are not as common as powers that do make use of surges. Clerics still have cure light wounds and its more powerful versions as daily utility spells and PH1 paladins can lay on hands Wisdom modifier times per day, which expends a healing surge from the paladin instead of the target.

 

[Hassassin]

I think most people who dislike healing surges probably also dislike wands of healing.

I think wands of healing are more of a campaign issue, while healing surges are a play style issue.

Some of my campaigns have CLW wands, some don't, but my play style is at odds with healing surges. So I kind of dislike both, but the wands not nearly so much.

 

[Falling Icicle]

I don't want healing surges, at least not the 4e type healing surge which is a limited number of times a character can be healer per day, including by magic. I don't necessarily mind letting non-magic users have means of recovery, but I hate not being able to heal someone, even if I have a spell, because they are all out of healing surges for the day. Horrible, horrible rule.

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

I disagree with attrition-based D&D - I want to be able to have five fights a day, or one fight a day, with each having equal danger and challenge.

I'd like to see all resources like daily spells (and this includes vancian magic) and daily healing surges go away, but I'd be fine with them remaining as encounter resources - you can be healed three times per fight if you're a fighter, for instance.

IMHO that would be a miserable game. The DM now has 2 choices, kill you or not even bother. Where's the tension? "Ho hum, we're not going to die in this one, who cares?" I'd find that boring as hell. The whole essence of the game is really the resource game. I think people fail to understand the degree to which that drives the whole game.