Skill Checks

[HatedRogue]

Have a quick question. When you have an opposed skill check the attempt is successful if your check result exceeds the result of the target. What skill wins on a tie. Like for stealth/perception it could be argued that someone is watching for you and you have to best his perception or your trying to hide and he is trying to best your stealth. Same with bluff/sense motive or sense motive/bluff.

Did I miss something in the rules somewhere?

 

[Drathir]

i cannot remember official ruling there but ive always run with higher modifier wins in most circumstances (hell its what i do on initiative ties too so yeah). I mean yeah there might be times when this isnt true like a good distance perception/stealth duel. I mean if your 100 feet away and still have a higher mod after penalty you still might not catch the guy, depends on cover and the like so in this example, heavy forest and foiliage, just cuz that bush moved doesnt mean someones there... could be a deer or something. hope this helps

 

[Tovec]

In cases such as stealth checks, the stealth sets the DC. You don't have to sneak past a perception of 16, but a perception roll of 16 is needed to see the guy stealthing.

So the reason you couldn't find the section that covers who wins in a tie is because it is an implied rule as opposed to one that specifically needed to be said. What I'm trying to say is that under Stealth it says you can try and avoid someone watching you but doesn't show a DC. It doesn't show a DC because the creature stealthing SETS the DC. But under Perception it says you have to notice the person sneaking past you and DOES provide other DCs you would have to match, mostly dealing with listen checks, but you'll notice that it mentions "notice a visible person" as DC 0. So noticing a stealing person is DC = whatever that person rolls on their stealth.

This was covered a little while ago. Let me see if I can find that thread.

EDIT: No luck in finding it. Also, edited for a bit more info. Added stuff in italics.

 

[billd91]

When I have the players roll opposed checks, I always do so from the point of view that the PCs must meet or beat the DC - not the NPCs. So no matter what the pairing, my NPC's roll sets the DC. This is true whether the PCs are trying to use stealth vs the NPC's perception or the reverse. As a result, all ties go to the PCs.

 

[Matthias]

Have a quick question. When you have an opposed skill check the attempt is successful if your check result exceeds the result of the target. What skill wins on a tie. Like for stealth/perception it could be argued that someone is watching for you and you have to best his perception or your trying to hide and he is trying to best your stealth. Same with bluff/sense motive or sense motive/bluff.

Did I miss something in the rules somewhere?

For any ordinary skill check when the DC is fixed, a character in question need only match the DC to succeed.

If the result of your skill check is equal to or greater than the difficulty class (or DC) of the task you are attempting to accomplish, you succeed. If it is less than the DC, you fail.

Here is the rule for succeeding on skill checks. However, it needs some elaboration.

"If the result of the skill check made by the character whose turn it is is equal to or greater than the difficulty class (or DC) of the task he is attempting to accomplish, he succeeds. If it is less than the DC, he fails."


Following this line of reasoning, I would say when there is a tie with an opposed check, the character who wins the tie is the one whose turn it actually is. This may not be applicable to the odd situation in which a GM needs to match up two or more NPCs who are both out-of-turn, or who are in a non-combat situation when there's not been an initiative roll, to see who wins the opposed checks. But an ad-hoc initiative roll (or perhaps an opposed ability check) could resolve the tie in such cases.


Edit: Nice theory if I say so, but then there's this rule:

When making an opposed skill check, the attempt is successful if your check result exceeds the result of the target.

Ah well.

 

[HatedRogue]

much obliged,
All the time offered to my question was appreciated and the answers where well worded to remove any more questions I had on this.

again thank you all for your posts.

My love to EN World