Sneak attatck of opportunity

[irdeggman]

There is a difference in the text used in the PHB and the SRD which is significant, IMO.

SRD:

Full-Round Action: A full-round action consumes all your effort during a round. The only movement you can take during a full-round action is a 5-foot step before, during, or after the action. You can also perform free actions (see below).[/quote

PHB:

FULL-ROUND ACTIONS
A full-round action requires an entire round to complete. Thus, it can’t be coupled with a standard or a move action, though if it does not involve moving any distance, you can take a 5-foot step.

Using the PHB a full-round action requires and entire round to complete which means that at any point in the round (from when you start your action) the action is being done. Hence the simultaneous action comes into play.

Using the SRD the case could be made that consuming all your effort is not the same.

Now, I haven't spotted any errata on the PHB for this (but I will need to check my collector's edition for any "stealth" errata before making a definitive statement here.)

Checked my Collector's edition and the text pretty well matches the 1st printing.

 

[cmanos]

Not sure if this has been brought up somewhere here before, but does a rouge get sneak attack durring an attack of opportunity?

Cosmetics do not get sneak attacks. Period.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

If I fall prone as a free action, make an attack at -4, and stand up as a move action in my turn... and then on your turn you swing your sword at me, do I take a penalty to my AC for being prone?

If I'm blind, and the cleric casts Remove Blindness on me, and then you attack me, am I denied my Dex bonus against your attack? Do I take a -2 to AC for being blind?

If on my turn I squeeze through a narrow space, and come out the other side into an open room, continuing another twenty feet, say, and then on your turn you attack me, do I take a -4 penalty to AC for squeezing?

-Hyp.

"No" to all three. But this is slightly different. You don't run for 6 seconds, wait a moment, and then run for 6 more seconds. Usually, you run straight through for a minute or more (unless you're really out of shape, then you might not even last the 6 seconds ).

So it would depend: Did he intend to run only this round and is now where he wants to be, or will he run again - or rather, still - next round.

 

[Hypersmurf]

"No" to all three. But this is slightly different. You don't run for 6 seconds, wait a moment, and then run for 6 more seconds. Usually, you run straight through for a minute or more (unless you're really out of shape, then you might not even last the 6 seconds ).

So it would depend: Did he intend to run only this round and is now where he wants to be, or will he run again - or rather, still - next round.

If the difference between running 1 round, running another 1 round, running another 1 round... or running continually for 3 rounds... is that in both cases I travel 360 feet, but in the first case I lose my Dex bonus during my turn, and in the second, I lose my Dex bonus for three rounds, it's pretty obvious which one I'm going to pick!

At the end of 1 round, I've travelled 120 feet, and I'm now where I want to be, so I stop. Then next round, I'll travel another 120 feet, and that's where I'll want to be, so I'll stop!

Using the PHB a full-round action requires and entire round to complete which means that at any point in the round (from when you start your action) the action is being done. Hence the simultaneous action comes into play.

I manifest Hustle as a swift action, take the full round action Full Attack, and use it to make three melee attacks with my greatsword. At the end of the full attack, I use my Hustle-granted move action to sheathe my greatsword.

On your turn, you shoot an arrow at me.

Can I Deflect it, since I have a free hand after sheathing my greatsword? Or can I not Deflect it, since my Full Attack takes an entire round to complete, and therefore my move action hasn't happened yet?

----

I'm a sorcerer, and on my turn I cast an Extended Mage Armor, requiring a full round action to cast. On your turn, you attack me. Is my spell in effect yet?

-Hyp.

 

[Zaruthustran]

I manifest Hustle as a swift action, take the full round action Full Attack, and use it to make three melee attacks with my greatsword. At the end of the full attack, I use my Hustle-granted move action to sheathe my greatsword.

On your turn, you shoot an arrow at me.

Can I Deflect it, since I have a free hand after sheathing my greatsword? Or can I not Deflect it, since my Full Attack takes an entire round to complete, and therefore my move action hasn't happened yet?

Let's simplify this example and just say after your full attack, you drop your greatsword as a free action. In this case, yes, you can delect because you have a hand free. Pretty cut-and-dried; no ambiguity. What's the issue?

I'm a sorcerer, and on my turn I cast an Extended Mage Armor, requiring a full round action to cast. On your turn, you attack me. Is my spell in effect yet?

-Hyp.

This is a different issue. A full attack and a spell with a 1 round casting time are both full-round actions, but the spell has an additional condition. The character is considered to be continually casting for the entire round (even through the turns of other characters) and the spell isn't finished until just before the character's next action:

(From Magic section)
When you begin a spell that takes 1 round or longer to cast, you must continue the concentration from the current round to just before your turn in the next round (at least). If you lose concentration before the casting is complete, you lose the spell.

(From Combat section)
When you begin a spell that takes 1 round or longer to cast, you must continue the invocations, gestures, and concentration from one round to just before your turn in the next round (at least). If you lose concentration after starting the spell and before it is complete, you lose the spell.

Compare to a full attack, which takes effect during the character's turn. Even though both are full-round actions they are resolved differently. The full attack, even though it's full-round, isn't considered to be a continuing action after the player's turn. The entire full attack is completely resolved during the acting player's turn.

-z

 

[mvincent]

in turn-based initiative, the opponent was not running when it was not his action... so while a readied bowshot would work, one taken in the rogue's own turn wouldn't work.

That doesn't seem right (and would have odd implications for climbing and balancing, which are handled similarly in regard to losing dex).

Assuming that you only lose your dex during your own movement seems to defeat the purpose of losing your dex.

 

[Hypersmurf]

This is a different issue. A full attack and a spell with a 1 round casting time are both full-round actions, but the spell has an additional condition. The character is considered to be continually casting for the entire round (even through the turns of other characters) and the spell isn't finished until just before the character's next action:

Extended Mage Armor isn't a spell with a 1 round casting time. It's a spell with a casting time of a full round action, because metamagic is being applied without preparation.

Summon Monster, for example, has a 1 round casting time, and acts as you describe. Extended Mage Armor has a casting time of a full round action (when cast by a sorcerer), which is not the same thing.

But the full attack example addresses irdeggman's contention that any full round action continues until your next turn... which suggests he'd rule that Extended Mage Armor does take as long to cast as Summon Monster.

-Hyp.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Assuming that you only lose your dex during your own movement seems to defeat the purpose of losing your dex.

If I run 120 feet and then stop, followed by which you shoot at me, am I running?

-Hyp.

 

[Dracorat]

Assuming that you only lose your dex during your own movement seems to defeat the purpose of losing your dex.

Don't forget attacks of opportunity for any threatened squares you exit during your run. In those cases, being denied your Dex bonus makes sense. Being shot while on another person's turn is easily justifiable (if a real world justification is what you are looking for) since they have not readied any action to shoot you as you run, which means they have not accounted for the situation at hand (you are running) any differently than normal.

Of course, this is a case where I am glad I use the facing rules from UA. If you run from me, even as a double move, you will most likely have your back exposed and then it's sneak attack city!!

 

[Zaruthustran]

Extended Mage Armor isn't a spell with a 1 round casting time. It's a spell with a casting time of a full round action, because metamagic is being applied without preparation.

Oops. You're right. Well this one's easy:

Casting a Metamagic Spell: Sorcerers and bards must take more time to cast a metamagic spell (one enhanced by a metamagic feat) than a regular spell. If a spell’s normal casting time is 1 standard action, casting a metamagic version of the spell is a full-round action for a sorcerer or bard. Note that this isn’t the same as a spell with a 1-round casting time—the spell takes effect in the same round that you begin casting, and you aren’t required to continue the invocations, gestures, and concentration until your next turn. For spells with a longer casting time, it takes an extra full-round action to cast the metamagic spell.

It's like a full attack in that the entire full-round action is resolved during just your turn. In these two cases "full-round" is more an expression of effort rather than time.

But the full attack example addresses irdeggman's contention that any full round action continues until your next turn... which suggests he'd rule that Extended Mage Armor does take as long to cast as Summon Monster.

-Hyp.

The SRD bit quoted above refutes his contention.

-z