Some things I'm curious about in 4th Ed

[Fanatic]

Just wanting peoples opinions on a few things. Also kind of a rant.

Firstly the only potions in the PHB are the four 'healing' type ones. I can accept this and understand it makes it easier, but out of curiosity is there any others / a formula to create new types if not? Just feels like my players will be missing their potions of invisibility and potions of bulls strength and such.

Secondly Invisibility (and greater invisibility at lvl 16) seems kind of useless. (Until end of next turn, attacking dispels, daily spell). Turning invisible for a turn gives an advantage, but at lvl 16 I would of expected more.

In fact the only difference between normal invisibility and greater seems that the range extends from 5 to 20 so it could be sustained allowing someone to sneak around for a little longer, even so, performing any offensive action removes it so =(.

I understand that it's a utility spell, so has effectiveness out of combat and works great in that respect, but it is no longer to be used in combat?

Personally I'm not too fussed considering my players enjoyed that spell a little too much last campaign but it feels very underpowered now.

Why not instead grab a cloak of invisibility (albeit a lvl 23 item) that has a daily that lasts until the end of encounter AND allows you to attack "You become invisible until the end of the encounter or until you are hit."
by a melee attack or a ranged attack."

 

[Xzylvador]

Probably will be an errata saying it's "until you attack or until you are hit"

 

[Samurai]

Probably will be an errata saying it's "until you attack or until you are hit"

Since Greater Invisibility has traditionally meant "you can now attack while invisible", and GI only requires a Minor Action to sustain it, not a Standard Action, meaning you should be able to attack and sustain it at the same time, I too think there will be errata on this.

 

[Aria Silverhands]

Eh, one of the issues in 3rd edition was the greater invisible wizard flying around the battlefield using a projected image to cast spells. I don't see a problem with nerfing greater invisibility a little.

 

[Jack99]

Eh, one of the issues in 3rd edition was the greater invisible wizard flying around the battlefield using a projected image to cast spells. I don't see a problem with nerfing greater invisibility a little.

But they already did. Sustain Minor to stay invis, makes it impossible to fly for more than a round, since fly is sustain minor as well.

Cheers

 

[Orryn Emrys]

But they already did. Sustain Minor to stay invis, makes it impossible to fly for more than a round, since fly is sustain minor as well.

But... can't you use a Move Action as a Minor...?

 

[Cadfan]

Having to choose between standing around invisible and casting spells, and flying around and casting spells, isn't THAT much of a nerf.

 

[Jack99]

But... can't you use a Move Action as a Minor...?

Round 1
Standard: Cast fly
Minor: whatever
Move: fly up

Round 2
Minor: Sustain fly
Standard: cast greater invis
move: fly elsewhere.

Round 3
minor sustain fly
move: convert to minor and sustain greater invis
standard: cast offensive spells

So yeah, you could sustain the fly and the invis, while casting spells, but you wouldn't be able to move around, so it would be fairly easy to locate you. If you want to move, you would have to use an action point or not cast an offensive spell every round. Which sounds much more "reasonable" to me. Also note that both spells are Dailies. It won't happen in every single combat

That is of course assuming that greater invis will be errata'ed.

 

[Charwoman Gene]

Even Invisibility isn't THAT nerfed.

 

[Aria Silverhands]

If you need to move, you just convert your move to minor and standard to move. That's one round wasted repositioning, and you can always spend an action point to cast a spell.