Something funny about bow max distance

[mmu1]

If anything, the missile weapon ranges are absurdly long.

I don't know what the flight time for a longbow arrow would be to 1000 feet, but I'd be willing to bet at least several seconds - and you'd have to point the bow so high up, it'd be really easy to loose sight of the target. Even worse with a crossbow, since in that case, the stock would completely obscure whathever you were aiming at.

But the -1 penalty for spot for every ten feet obviosuly doesn't work all that well either - I'd say apply it only to spotting people who are actively trying to hide (which presupposes cover, since D&D doesn't allow hiding in plain sight in normal circumstances) - getting a -10 to spot someone hiding behind a tree 100 feet away doesn't really seem unreasonable.

 

[reapersaurus]

mmu1 beat me to the point:

It's not whether or not an archer COULD hit an object at that distance, it's whether or not it should be allowed in a non-surprise situation.

It completely breaks my suspension of disbelief to have an archer rainbowing these long bombs across a couple football fields, when all the target would have to do is sidestep a couple feet.

 

[Ziggy]

It completely breaks my suspension of disbelief to have an archer rainbowing these long bombs across a couple football fields, when all the target would have to do is sidestep a couple feet.

But with the current rules for spot it's almost impossible to spot the archer/arrow, so it sort of makes sense
[Two wrongs make one right ?]

.Ziggy

 

[Ziggy]

But the -1 penalty for spot for every ten feet obviosuly doesn't work all that well either - I'd say apply it only to spotting people who are actively trying to hide (which presupposes cover, since D&D doesn't allow hiding in plain sight in normal circumstances) - getting a -10 to spot someone hiding behind a tree 100 feet away doesn't really seem unreasonable.

It works pretty well for short distances, but not at all for longer ranges. Let's say that you have a 50% chance of spotting someone at 100 feet. If the same person is hiding under the same conditions at 200 feet, you'll have 0% chance of spotting him. While it's reasonable that its harder to spot at longer ranges, the penalty is far too steep.

It gets more absurd if you have a really high difference in skill. Lets take the example of a high level ranger (Spot 30) vs. a 1st level fighter in plate (Hide -8). Both are taking 10. The ranger will have a 100% spot chance out to 380 feet, a 50% chance at 480 feet, and no chance at 580 feet or longer. Thus while he can spot the fighter perfectly at pretty long ranges (more than 100 yards), his vision degrades suddenly after that range, and he is invisible at 200 yards.

The real world just doesn't work that way.

.Ziggy

 

[Shard O'Glase]

I think part of the problem is there are two types of spot I can think of. One, hey look some guy is at the end of the field. The other is hey look that's a red stone ring on his hand.

Red Stone ring when at 0-5' should be DC0 to notice, when at 100' probably should be dc40+ to notice. Spot a person who isn't hiding at 0-5ft should be automatic, at 100' should still be close to automatic, maybe dc5. Depending on what your trying to sopt the dc should have different rates at which it becomes more difficult.

Maybe it should be something like every 10' you get a penalty based on its size mod to ac to see it. If the object is medium or larger you get a -1 to spot every 20'+(10'xsize mod to ac).

 

[Number47]

I think the problem you're having with the bow ranges is that you're looking at it backwards. They aren't expecting to be able to shoot farther than you can see. They are giving far less penalties to shoot out to the limit of your sight. The max distance on a longbow should never be used, but it is easier to hit someone 300 feet away with a longbow than with a shortbow.

To also contribute to the hijack, I think the Spot distances seem a little silly, too. There needs to a couple of paragraphs in there about when and where to apply this kind of penalty. For instance, if you are attempting to Spot someone coming from one direction only, your chances should go up, like +20. You should also get a huge bonus for elevation. Thus, being on top of the castle wall and looking only up the road for trespassers on an otherwise flat plain at noon should warrant a very long encounter distance against somebody not hiding. They obviously tried to simplify it so 3E wouldn't become the mess-o-charts that previous editions were, but a footnote as to conditions and DM oversight woulda been nice.

 

[misttar]

Seen it done

My party decided the best deversion was to start a fire in a enemy fort.

The elven archer (with farshot) decides to fire from his maximum range. So Hitting a Bale of hay from 1400ft away (thats a -18 to hit penatly), was still able to hit the bale on a 3 or better with his first shot and 9 or better on his second. Thats at level freeken 9.

Bale
Medium size +0
Unattended -5 (for no dex)
Total AC 5

Archer
BAB 9/4
Dex 22 +6
Weapon Focus +1
Bow +1
Arrow Masterwork +1
Bracers of Archery +2
Total +20/+15