Sorcerer----spell system

[DarkJester]

Well,not exactly a spell point system. Our dm has done away with wizards (doesn't think they fit his campaign), but he also belives that sorcerers are missing something. He has been trying to come up with some sort of system that would allow a sorcerer to have greater selection of his spells.

He told us what his basic idea(s) were and asked us each if we could come up with something worthwhile.He was looking for as follows:
1. A system for sorcerers to learn new (as in more than now limited to) spells known. He said it should be very difficult, and have hazards associated with it.(such as having a haste spell your trying to learn age you X years if you fail)

2. A system that allows for sorcerers to use lower level spells slots to cast higher level spells, or perhaps to cast spells when none are left.

I have thought about this a bit. I was thinking something along the lines of,you take the difference in spell level ,(say you wanted to cast a fireball,using a magic missle slot=2) Square that,and times by two.....you take that much subual damage.

3. Going along with number 1, a system to cast unknown spells of higher levels.

I was thinking of sort of the thing with number 2 above,except you take that +1d4 temp con damage,if this brings your total to 1 or less, you loose 1 perm con. (As in gone, no spell able to restore it short of a wish)

Anyone have any ideas about any/all of the above? I am not the dm of the game, just a player, only reason I'm even bothering with it is because my rogue is lagging behind in levels, and he's gona give an experience bonus if someone can actually give him some ideas.

 

[DreamChaser]

The idea of casting spells past the limit could be workable provided the penalty was great enough. It should not be automatic and the damage should be significant. I think of it as the sorcerer using his life force as energy in place of magic energy (mana if you will).

The problem with your idea is that according to the Ability Damage rules, reaching a 0 Con, whether from damage or drain means death. Your idea means creating an exception to the basic rules which can be hard to justify without Rule 0ing the whole thing.

I think subdual damage can do the same thing. Especially considering how few HP sorcerers have. Make the sorcerer make a spellcraft or concentration check, DC 15 + 2 x spell level. Whether he succeeds or not, he takes subdual damage equal to the spell level +1. If he rolls a "1" on his skill check, he takes real damage instead of subdual.

In addition, the sorcerer could not attempt to force a spell like this if he has a higher level spell slot available to use. If he has magical energy available to cast the spell, he must use it.

Just my thoughts...

 

[DreamChaser]

I suppose, this system could also be used to attempt a higher level spell than the sorcerer could normally cast. I would require that the spell be related to a spell the sorcerer knows to justify his knowledge of it. The sorcerer would then make a check to force the spell as though he knew it but the DC would be higher (perhaps add 5).

The damage might be greater, too. Perhaps 2x normal. Or automatically standard damage instead of subdual. This isn't necessary though. Just the increased difficulty might be offputting enough.

 

[adndgamer]

I like this idea. I've always liked the idea of being able to cast a really high level spell at the cost of damage to yourself.

Hm. And if he wants it to be hazardous, I'd make you roll a d20 each time you cast a spell, and if you roll a 1, you have to roll on a wild surge table (if you don't nkow what this is, do a search for it on google).

-Paul

 

[Ciaran]

Have you looked at the overchanneling rules from Wheel of Time d20?

- Eric

 

[JDRay]

Following this same sort of logic, why have spell levels at all? If you're going to establish a level of difficulty to cast a spell (currenltly referred to as "spell level"), but separate that from an arcanist's actual ability to cast the spell, then why worry about having the spells/spell level/character level progression at all?

Some sort of procedure could be developed whereby, at each level, a caster gains one or more spell slots that he can use in a day. They'd be spell level independant. Couple with that a progression formula that says how difficult a spell he can cast, much like Concentration, but with an extra variable, and you've got the start of a system. Include damage for spell failure, and you give the character reason NOT to try and cast outside his normal boundaries without thinking about it.

So, your first level arcanist could cast, say, two Magic Missiles per day without trouble. But if he wanted to upgrade one of those slots to Sepia Snake Sigil, it he would incur a moderately high (maybe 50%) chance of failure. Further, on failure, he takes some damage (maybe something like twice the spell level minus his CON adjustment, giving arcane casters a reason to want CON). The greater the spell level attempted, the greater the chance of failure. [This formula for damage is probably pretty heavy, but it would sure keep low level casters from trying to cast fifth level spells.]

Without belaboring this, what ideas do you have for or against?