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Special Conversion Thread: Finishing off the oozes

Shade

Monster Junkie
7 HD it is!

Gold: Str 19, Dex 16, Con 22, Int 5, Wis 11, Cha 1
Iron: Str 25, Dex 14, Con 24, Int 5, Wis 11, Cha 1
Platinum: Str 24, Dex 15, Con 22, Int 5, Wis 11, Cha 1

So how about Str 21, Dex 15, Con 22, Int 5, Wis 11, Cha 1?
 

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Big Mac

Explorer
Shade said:
So how about Str 21, Dex 15, Con 22, Int 5, Wis 11, Cha 1?
I'm not totally sure on the logic of stat placement yet - I'm guessing this is something without a forumular. However, the numbers look pretty good to me, especially Int, Wis and Cha.

If the silver silatic ever starts to look a bit too powerful (and you need to cut its power) I think you could take away from Str or Dex. I think it could be slightly weaker or slightly slower and still be dangerous.
 

Shade

Monster Junkie
Added to Homebrews.

To address the suggested abilities above:

Four 25 foot pseudopods - instead of 2 50 foot pseudopods*. (I figure that halving the length of the pseudopods will cancel out a little bit of the extra arm advantage.)
Done. I also reduced the damage to help offset the additional attacks.

Some sort of combat advantage against lycanthropes. (They should count as silvered weapons for damage reduction.)
Done.

Ability to conduct electricity. Attacks like lightning go through and hit whatever is touching the Silver Silatic. (Or some sort of save to "bounce" electrical attacks.)

Ability to conduct heat. Fire and cold attacks go through and hit whatever is touching the Silver Silatic. (Or some sort of save to "bounce" heat/cold attacks.)
Lets simplify this to resistance to cold 10, electricity 10, and fire 10 to keep them in line with the other silatics and not overcomplicate them.

Highly reflective. Gaze attacks (or beholder eye rays) bounce off of the creature and hit a random creature in the nearby area. (Or some sort of save to "bounce" eye based attacks.)
Hmmm...we could give them a spell turning mechanic rather than the spell resistance the others possess. Thoughts?

Argyria: A Silver Silatic's metal digesting juices contain a chemical that permanantly changes the colour of skin to a grey or blue-grey colour next time it is exposed to sunlight. Any humanoid, monstrous humanoid or giant creature that takes damage from a pseudopod of a silver silatic that is feeding must succeed on a DC X (Fortutude?) save or its skin colour will gradually change colour as exposure to the sun binds the chemical into its skin. (I'm guessing that X = number of hit points of damage in the entire combat.)
Interesting, but since it has no mechanical effect, perhaps we can just make if flavor text?
 

Big Mac

Explorer
Shade said:
Added to Homebrews.

To address the suggested abilities above:

Big Mac said:
Four 25 foot pseudopods - instead of 2 50 foot pseudopods*. (I figure that halving the length of the pseudopods will cancel out a little bit of the extra arm advantage.)
Done. I also reduced the damage to help offset the additional attacks.
The reduced damage is a nice touch.

Shade said:
Big Mac said:
Some sort of combat advantage against lycanthropes. (They should count as silvered weapons for damage reduction.)
Done.
Erm. I can't see this. Where is it?

Shade said:
Big Mac said:
Ability to conduct electricity. Attacks like lightning go through and hit whatever is touching the Silver Silatic. (Or some sort of save to "bounce" electrical attacks.)

Ability to conduct heat. Fire and cold attacks go through and hit whatever is touching the Silver Silatic. (Or some sort of save to "bounce" heat/cold attacks.)
Lets simplify this to resistance to cold 10, electricity 10, and fire 10 to keep them in line with the other silatics and not overcomplicate them.
Fair enough. It saves inventing an ability.

Shade said:
Big Mac said:
Highly reflective. Gaze attacks (or beholder eye rays) bounce off of the creature and hit a random creature in the nearby area. (Or some sort of save to "bounce" eye based attacks.)
Hmmm...we could give them a spell turning mechanic rather than the spell resistance the others possess. Thoughts?
That is good, because it swaps one ability for another and keeps the total abilities down. A shield of Great Reflection has a mechanic that might help:

SRD said:
Any time its bearer of this shield is targeted with a spell, it automatically reflects the spell back at the caster (as the spell turning spell). The wearer can lower or raise this effect as a free action (thus allowing beneficial spells in as desired).
That is epic, and I think that "automatic" is a bit more powerful that the spell resistance other silatics have. Maybe the reflection could work whenever spell resistance would normally work. How does this look:

Spell Reflection (Sp): A silver silatic has a reflective form of spell resistance that affects spells targeted directly against the silatic.

Whenever a spellcaster targets a spell against the silver silatic they have to make a caster level check (as if opposing spell resistance). If the caster fails the check, their spell is reflected back onto them (as if affected by a spell turning spell).

Spell reflection only affects targeted spells and has no effect on area spells or effect spells. Any spell that isn't stopped by spell resistance is also not reflected by spell reflection.​

I don't think that a silver silatic should be able to voluntarily lower its spell reflextion ability (when benificial spells were cast upon it).

Shade said:
Big Mac said:
Argyria: A Silver Silatic's metal digesting juices contain a chemical that permanantly changes the colour of skin to a grey or blue-grey colour next time it is exposed to sunlight. Any humanoid, monstrous humanoid or giant creature that takes damage from a pseudopod of a silver silatic that is feeding must succeed on a DC X (Fortutude?) save or its skin colour will gradually change colour as exposure to the sun binds the chemical into its skin. (I'm guessing that X = number of hit points of damage in the entire combat.)
Interesting, but since it has no mechanical effect, perhaps we can just make if flavor text?
I did read that people with Argyria get itchy skin, so if the silver silatic could cause algyria, we could give anyone suffering from it Light Sensitive Skin that itches in sunlight and causes them a -2 penalty to any concentration checks.
 

freyar

Extradimensional Explorer
I like the spell reflection. That should work pretty well, but I do think it should be Su rather than Sp.
 

Big Mac

Explorer
freyar said:
I like the spell reflection. That should work pretty well, but I do think it should be Su rather than Sp.
Thanks. I tried my best to make it fit in with several similar things. The (Sp) was a guess, because I didn't think this was a (Ex) any more. So if you think this is (Su) feel free to change it.
 

Shade

Monster Junkie
Big Mac said:
I did read that people with Argyria get itchy skin, so if the silver silatic could cause algyria, we could give anyone suffering from it Light Sensitive Skin that itches in sunlight and causes them a -2 penalty to any concentration checks.
You know, I like the idea of it causing light sensitivity even better! I can't think of a single creature that causes that condition, which would give this fella a unique niche.

Here's light sensitivity:

Light Sensitivity (Ex): Orcs are dazzled in bright sunlight or within the radius of a daylight spell.

Here's another creature (from MM2) with spell reflection:

Spell Reflection (Su): The morkoth has a special type of spell resistance that causes the effect of any spell, spell-like ability, or magic item that it successfully resists (even those that affect areas) to bounce off and reflect back at the caster. If the caster of a spell or the user of a spell-like ability or magic item fails a caster level check (DC 15), he or she becomes either the spell's target or the point of origin for the spell's effect, as appropriate. If the morkoth is the subject of a dispel magic spell that is not reflected, its spell reflection ability is suppressed for 1 round.

And here's how the tarrasque uses spell reflection:

Carapace (Ex): The tarrasque’s armorlike carapace is exceptionally tough and highly reflective, deflecting all rays, lines, cones, and even magic missile spells. There is a 30% chance of reflecting any such effect back at the caster; otherwise, it is merely negated. Check for reflection before rolling to overcome the creature’s spell resistance.
 

demiurge1138

Inventor of Super-Toast
How does spell reflection work for the aoa from Fiend Folio? Seeing as how it's a big lump of silver, it'd probably be a good mechanical model. Currently, I'm leaning closer to the morkoth than to the tarrasque's reflective carapace.
 

Shade

Monster Junkie
Reflective Spell Resistance (Sp): An aoa has a special type of spell resistance that causes any targeted spell it successfully resists to bounce off and reflect back at the caster. The caster becomes either the spell's target or the point of origin for the spell's effect, as appropriate. In addition, aoa are immune to gaze attacks, and such an effect is reflected back to its origin.
 

Big Mac

Explorer
Shade said:
You know, I like the idea of it causing light sensitivity even better! I can't think of a single creature that causes that condition, which would give this fella a unique niche.

Here's light sensitivity:

Light Sensitivity (Ex): Orcs are dazzled in bright sunlight or within the radius of a daylight spell.
I was originally thinking of skin sensitivity rather than sight sensitivity, but I suppose eyesight problems would fit in with the afflicted creature having eyes that turn grey in sunlight.

But this condition was supposed to be a permanant one. Maybe it is too hard to implement. Maybe we should just stick with refective attacks and sell this creature as a shiney creature.

Shade said:
Reflective Spell Resistance (Sp): An aoa has a special type of spell resistance that causes any targeted spell it successfully resists to bounce off and reflect back at the caster. The caster becomes either the spell's target or the point of origin for the spell's effect, as appropriate. In addition, aoa are immune to gaze attacks, and such an effect is reflected back to its origin.
I like the aoa's Reflective Spell Resistance the best. It is the monster with the clearest wording, and also has the added bonus of reflecting gaze attacks.
 

freyar

Extradimensional Explorer
I think what Big Mac has is closest to the Morkoth and Aoa, and any of these is good with me.
 

Shade

Monster Junkie
Let's decide on an amount for the reflective spell resistance.

The gold and platinum have spell resistance CR+7. Shall we just use that here?
 

Big Mac

Explorer
freyar said:
I think what Big Mac has is closest to the Morkoth and Aoa, and any of these is good with me.
I think I prefer the wording of the Aoa to what I originally suggested. It is shorter and also adds that great gaze reflection. That really fits in well with the other stuff we have.

Shade said:
Let's decide on an amount for the reflective spell resistance.

The gold and platinum have spell resistance CR+7. Shall we just use that here?
If I were writing the silver silatic for 2nd edition, I'd put it on an equal footing with the Magic Resistance of the gold and platinum (30%), so CR+7 sounds perfect for the spell resistance. (Making these creatures have as much resistance as an iron silatic would make these creatures very dangerous.)
 




Shade

Monster Junkie
Updated.

How's this?

Disease (Ex): A creature struck by a silver silatic must succeed on a DC X Fortitude save or acquire a disease called argyria. The disease has an onset of 1 day. The victim's skin and eyes become sensistive to sunlight. The victim is dazzled in bright sunlight or within the radius of a daylight spell, and suffers a -2 penalty to Concentration checks in these light conditions. The save DC is Constitution-based.

We still need...

Speed: x ft. (x squares)
Gold is 30 ft., the others are 15 ft.

Feats: 3
We gave gold Cleave, Improved Initiative, Improved Sunder, Power Attack
We gave platinum Ability Focus (acid), Improved Initiative, Improved Sunder, Power Attack
We gave iron Improved Initiative, Improved Sunder, Power Attack

A typical specimen weighs about x pounds. Big Mac's findings upthread indicate silver has a specific gravity of about half of gold, so we could just halve the gold's weight, giving us 150 pounds. But, that makes it less than iron at 200 pounds, which supposedly weighs less than silver.

We currently have...

Iron = 200 pounds
Gold = 300 pounds
Platinum = 600 pounds

We could revise to...

Iron = 150 pounds
Silver = 200 pounds
Gold = 400 pounds
Platinum = 800 pounds

...or just make silver 150 and drop iron to 125.
 

freyar

Extradimensional Explorer
The disease looks good.

Let's keep to 15 ft.

Feats: Imp Init, Imp Sunder, Power Attack.

I like 150, 200, 400, 800 lb.
 

Big Mac

Explorer
freyar said:
The disease looks good.
I agree with the effects. It still might be worth adding a bit of flavor text that mentions a silvery-grey colour. How about adding it to the end of the third sentence, like this:

The victim's skin and eyes become sensistive to sunlight, and take on a silvery-grey shade that is easily noticed by anyone they meet.​

This is a non-magical disease, so I'm not sure if you want to mention something like:

Argyria is instantly cured by a Remove Disease or Heal spell. A victim of argyria gains no benifit if a Remove Curse spell is cast upon them. However a Remove Blindness/Deafness spell is partially effective - restoring their eyesight, but not their natural skin colour.​

freyar said:
Let's keep to 15 ft.
I'd agree with that.

freyar said:
Feats: Imp Init, Imp Sunder, Power Attack.
Again, I'd agree with this.

freyar said:
I like 150, 200, 400, 800 lb.
This sounds good.

Another alternative, would be to keep the existing weights and make the silver silatic slightly smaller or thiner. Or keep it heavy but give it a lower percentage of silver (and lower its "treasure" content).
 

freyar

Extradimensional Explorer
I don't think we need to mention anything specific about the disease, since nonmagical is the "default" setting for diseases.

And let's keep the treasure content where it is, since they don't have any other treasure.
 

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