spells that lost popularity in 3.0/3.5

[Grue]

The thing about stoneskin is that it used to be a spell to protect you for a short time from super tough monsters pounding on you. Now it's a spell to protect you from low-level mooks. Even a lowly ogre is still quite a threat to you. And the way damage output from monsters really skyrockets, it's less and less useful as you encounter more and more dangerous things.

Additionally, if a wizard needs to protect against damage from mooks the front-line either isn't doing it's job or the wizard needs to keep a better eye on his defenses. The best defense against mooks is a higher ac or avoidance either via other better defensive\movement spells or tactical position. Unless built\prepped for it, it's terribly easy for a mob of mooks to grapple, pin, and coup de grace a typically low strength wizo quickly, stoneskin or no stoneskin.

With d4 hit points plus con mod, a 10 dr isn't much of a buffer against tougher baddies... at least considering the other spells you could have put into that 4th level slot.

 

[Nifft]

With d4 hit points plus con mod, a 10 dr isn't much of a buffer against tougher baddies... at least considering the other spells you could have put into that 4th level slot.

Stoneskin has a range of Touch. It's not just for Wizards any more! It's most useful when used to buff their minions fellow party members.

Cheers, -- N

 

[lukelightning]

Clerics originally got hold person because they were supposedly goody-two-shoes holy men who carry blunt weapons to avoid spilling blood and all that. So they got to hold people to avoid bloodshed. Which, of course, never happened. Anyone who got held just got chopped dead the next round or so.

 

[Victim]

Stoneskin has a range of Touch. It's not just for Wizards any more! It's most useful when used to buff their minions fellow party members.

Cheers, -- N

It had a range of touch in 2nd too.

Additionally, if a wizard needs to protect against damage from mooks the front-line either isn't doing it's job or the wizard needs to keep a better eye on his defenses. The best defense against mooks is a higher ac or avoidance either via other better defensive\movement spells or tactical position.

Tactical position is just awesome in a game that has all kinds ranged attacks and movement effects. At the same level Stoneskin is available, a caster can also prep D-Door and use it to drop a few delaying fighter types into a flanking position on an enemy backliner.

It's not that Stoneskin is awesome, but it's valuable against certain types of enemies and as part of a layered defense. Having the DR is good if a serious attacker does get to the caster's position, or against a spam type ranged attacker.

That being said, it's not my first pick for a 4th level defensive spell.

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The value of the Strength spell depended largely on the strength scores of people in the party. Someone with a mid percentile strength is low enough not to get much extra benefit, but high enough that the spell has a good chance of pumping him to the really good bonus tiers. Similarly, someone with a lowish STR could also start getting some bonuses.

The real downside to strength was the 10 minute casting time.

In my experience though, it wasn't that widely used. 3.0 was probably the spell's greatest hour, since you could easily use the ability boosters as cheap substitutes for stat boosting items for a long time. Or expensive metamagiced buffs that were even better than the items.

 

[Grue]

Stoneskin has a range of Touch. It's not just for Wizards any more! It's most useful when used to buff their minions fellow party members.

Cheers, -- N

Yep, but it's a 250 gp a pop too. If the party has a half-way decent healer, shaving off 10 hp a hit on one (hopefully) higher hit point front line type just is a bit harder to justify putting it in memory when compared to the other 4th level spells in the toolbox. Unless the party has a high damage output, low ac great cleaving melee attacker set up to mow through rows of scuts (ugh, frenzied spike chain wielding barbarian comes to mind) it's a difficult one to pick over say a D-Door or enveration.

 

[kenobi65]

Taking out the rebounding effect was a horrible 3.0 nerf...ditto for the loss of fill-the-volume fireballs...

I fondly recall horribly abusing both effects with my 1E wizard...filling huge expanses of dungeon with fireballs...arranging lightning bolt rebounds so they'd get targets twice...