Spiked chain + Imp. Trip + Combat Reflexes + Enlarge Person

[heliopolix]

I am GMing a campain, in which one of my players managed to create a human fighter with an 17 dex & 16 str. He took the feats Exotic Wpn Proficiency(Spiked chain), Combat Expertise, and Improvd Trip. With his 10' threaten area, nothing could get close to him w/o getting tripped (because you can make a Trip Attack as an AoO), and once he reached 2nd level and took Combat Reflexes, he could hold his own by himself against pretty much anything I threw at the party. I tried using an ogre (CR 3) vs the three 2nd lvl characters, but the fighter simply had the cleric cast enlarge person on him, and layed "teh smackdown" on the ogre without the ogre getting close to him. The character has since died, so I can now bring the situation to these forums.

I am aware that the combo is a legitamate one, yet I am pondering what CR1 creatures could face a 1st lvl fighter with the first three feats and provide a challenge.

Any insight would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Ottergame]

I am GMing a campain, in which one of my players managed to create a human fighter with an 17 dex & 16 str. He took the feats Exotic Wpn Proficiency(Spiked chain), Combat Expertise, and Improvd Trip. With his 10' threaten area, nothing could get close to him w/o getting tripped (because you can make a Trip Attack as an AoO), and once he reached 2nd level and took Combat Reflexes, he could hold his own by himself against pretty much anything I threw at the party. I tried using an ogre (CR 3) vs the three 2nd lvl characters, but the fighter simply had the cleric cast enlarge person on him, and layed "teh smackdown" on the ogre without the ogre getting close to him. The character has since died, so I can now bring the situation to these forums.

I am aware that the combo is a legitamate one, yet I am pondering what CR1 creatures could face a 1st lvl fighter with the first three feats and provide a challenge.

Any insight would be greatly appreciated.

Ranged weapon users are great. Spell casters can nuke or bind him at range. Also, try beefing up their touch ACs by giving them high dex or dodge bonuses. Centaurs and dwarves and more resistant to trips. Or turn the tables on him, get a bunch of large spiked chain users together and surprise him.

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

Missile weapons.

Narrow corridors, or obstacles that provide cover.

It's not the creatures; it's their tactics.

 

[Ottergame]

Ranged weapon users are great. Spell casters can nuke or bind him at range. Also, try beefing up their touch ACs by giving them high dex or dodge bonuses. Centaurs and dwarves and more resistant to trips. Or turn the tables on him, get a bunch of large spiked chain users together and surprise him.

Or to be really mean... hasted centaur druids using spiked chains and improved trip.

 

[Ferox4]

The character has since died, so I can now bring the situation to these forums.

Well, it looks like something was more than enough of a challenge for him.......

He will be difficult to overmatch in melee combat, but he is still susceptable to ranged attacks and his Will save sucks - so you could use Charm Person, Hold Person, Command and a number of lower level mind-affecting spells.

 

[Ferox4]

It's not the creatures; it's their tactics.

Very, very wise words.

 

[silentspace]

cover and concealment

 

[Shadowdweller]

Sunder also works really great against spiked chain users.

 

[Scion]

So vs the ogre he needs to have enlarge on himself (just to get a better reach), he has to have a lot of feats specializing in a useful fashion, he has to make a melee touch attack (not hard, but still a chance of failure), he has to succeed at an opposed strength check (an average ogre has a 21, some have more others less.. but the ogre should at least have a 5% better chance to win at this level..

so all in all.. at least one spell on the fighter, lots of feats, a special weapon, melee touch attack, opposed strength check.. along with not having to worry about any obstructions, lighting, reach weapon in the ogres hands.. plus if the guy fails at any of the checks he is fried..

doesnt sound too bad to me hard to work around at times yes, requires special thinking.. but not horrible..

 

[heliopolix]

Well, it looks like something was more than enough of a challenge for him.......

TPK was what happened, he was just one of the casualties.

doesnt sound too bad to me hard to work around at times yes, requires special thinking.. but not horrible..

I agree with you about the heavy feat loadout required, and as to the suggestions made to combat it, most of those were things I had considered in some form (except for the spiked chain weilding centaur druids). I was just really wondering about how to balance it at 1st level.

Also, he had multiclassed to Rogue & Hexblade to get Evasion and Mettle, so spellcasting was a difficulty as well. What doomed him were his more limited Hit Points though.

So vs the ogre he needs to have enlarge on himself (just to get a better reach), he has to have a lot of feats specializing in a useful fashion, he has to make a melee touch attack (not hard, but still a chance of failure), he has to succeed at an opposed strength check (an average ogre has a 21, some have more others less.. but the ogre should at least have a 5% better chance to win at this level..

As to that, characters bonuses were +12 (+4 Str [str 19 due to the enlarge], +4 size [large from the enlarge], and +4 competence[from improved trip]), opposed by the ogre with a +9 (+5 str [str 21] and +4 size [large]).