D&D General (SPOILERS for Vecna: Eve of Ruin) Are My Standards Too High for Adventures?

[Parmandur]

Sure, you could do KotB without planning. But it would be garbage, just like a modern adventure with no planning.

Of course, as kids, we tended to be too undiscerning to notice.

My wife ran Loat Mines of Phandelver back in 2014 with no planning and no prior DMing experience...and it went very, very well.

Same with me and Hoard of the Dragon Queen, of all things.

It is doable.

But more prep will always be better.

 

[dave2008]

No, WotC pays for the paper, ink, and printing in bulk, it really doesn't cost that much to make these products and the rpg team doesn't get payed crazy money either. They could charge less, they've shown that with the 1D&D core books, they choose not to.

Just as you don't know this, I don't the specifics either. You don't know what WotC's material cost are, or what they pay the desigers, editors, artist, etc. We do know (from Morrus) that they pay more than most, if not all, than the rest of the industry. So I guess they could come down to the crowd in their pay if they want to spend less.

I also know that my statement is generally true when it comes to the economics of any industry.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Just as you don't know this, I don't the specifics either. You don't know what WotC's material cost are, or what they pay the desigers, editors, artist, etc. We do know (from Morrus) that they pay more than most, if not all, than the rest of the industry. So I guess they could come down to the crowd in their pay if they want to spend less.

I also know that my statement is generally true when it comes to the economics of any industry.

These days the cost of paper, ink and especially transport are skyrocketing. That's why there is such a push to get everyone online.

 

[Parmandur]

These days the cost of paper, ink and especially transport are skyrocketing. That's why there is such a push to get everyone online.

That and WotC usually prints in the US instead of China, which raises their costs but improves their logistical turnaround.

 

[Parmandur]

It is typically 50% to WotC, and 50% split between distributor and retailer, is it not?

Here are some rough numbers from a prior thread:

My only gripe with the article is one of numbers - we retailers get more like 40-45% off on D&D books from distributors. I've also heard from distributors that their margins aren't anywhere near what ours are, so @Alphastream, your later conclusion that WotC probably gets more than 25% jives with what I would expect. It's not Retail 60 Distributor 30 WotC 15. It's probably more like Retail 60 Distributor 35 WotC 25. With a big chunk of WotC's profit being lost to printing and shipping costs (shipping from the printers, the other shipping costs are passed on to us, much of the time).

But your conclusions look pretty close to right to me - nothing I could argue with. They're a guess, but they're as close to reality as I can imagine. I would guess (and this is based on nothing more than gut and the numbers that I've heard) but I expect that DDB sales are somewhere between a quarter and half of total print sales (and growing).

So, based on this, WotC cut is going up from ~$12.50 to ~$15 per book when they upped the price.

 

[the Jester]

I don't think it's a manner of standards but of priorities. WOTC adventures are designed for certain things. The OP wants different things in their adventures.

I really do feel that not violating the central conceits of a setting (e.g. "it's hard as hell to get out of Ravenloft") just to have that setting make a cameo that could, frankly, be replaced by any other setting without that conceit is a preeetty low bar to pass over.

In the case of Eve of Ruin, we visit Ravenloft for no particular reason. There is no reason that that piece of the Rod couldn't be on Krynn, or Mystara, or be a second piece on Faerun or Greyhawk. There is no plot-related reason for it to be where, by all rights, the pcs should end up in a five-level diversion of trying to survive the horrors of Ravenloft instead of it being a one- or two-session drop-in in a campaign setting that can accommodate such things without breaking one of its main setting rules.

I'm really a bit baffled at the choice. I get that Ravenloft, and especially Barovia, is popular; but it's not a suitable choice for the adventure if you're trying to maintain the Ravenloft feel, and it's pointless to misuse it this way if you're not.

It would be like if they spelled it "Strawd" in five places in the book- it's a pretty bad error, in my judgement.

 

[Parmandur]

I really do feel that not violating the central conceits of a setting (e.g. "it's hard as hell to get out of Ravenloft") just to have that setting make a cameo that could, frankly, be replaced by any other setting without that conceit is a preeetty low bar to pass over.

In the case of Eve of Ruin, we visit Ravenloft for no particular reason. There is no reason that that piece of the Rod couldn't be on Krynn, or Mystara, or be a second piece on Faerun or Greyhawk. There is no plot-related reason for it to be where, by all rights, the pcs should end up in a five-level diversion of trying to survive the horrors of Ravenloft instead of it being a one- or two-session drop-in in a campaign setting that can accommodate such things without breaking one of its main setting rules.

I'm really a bit baffled at the choice. I get that Ravenloft, and especially Barovia, is popular; but it's not a suitable choice for the adventure if you're trying to maintain the Ravenloft feel, and it's pointless to misuse it this way if you're not.

It would be like if they spelled it "Strawd" in five places in the book- it's a pretty bad error, in my judgement.

I haven't read this one yet, but the whole concept of this particular Campaign us that it is an Epic Level tour of the Multiverse: ao, yeah, it will be easy to get to and from places. That's the concept.

 

[Reynard]

Here are some rough numbers from a prior thread:


So, based on this, WotC cut is going up from ~$12.50 to ~$15 per book when they upped the price.

Thanks. So, who takes the hit from the Amazon discount? Is that the retailer or the distributor getting cut out?

 

[Paul Farquhar]

That and WotC usually prints in the US instead of China, which raises their costs but improves their logistical turnaround.

Not here!

I miss the days of TSRUK, when products didn't have to travel thousands of miles.


(Okay, for the geography geeks, I think the USA is closer than China).

 

[billd91]

No, it's not. In one, I buy what I want. In the other, I have to buy a bunch of stuff I don't want to get the thing I want.

This may be dating me a bit but... you mean like buying a record album?