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Starting an Eberron Campaign - The Forgotten Forge

jaults

First Post
I am starting an Eberron campaign tomorrow, and plan to run The Forgotten Forge. The PCs are:

* A human cleric of the Silver Flame who's father is a high ranking priest within the church. Out to explore the world and bring flame and righteousness to wrongdoers. (NG)
* A Warforged fighter, bonded to the cleric, sent as a bodyguard.
* A gnome artificer of House Sivis. Good social skills. (CN)
* A changling rogue, friends with the gnome. It/She masquerades as the gnome's many, many girlfriends. They plan to become a thieving team, using the gnome's contacts within Sivis to learn about rich people to rob. (CN)

Should be an interesting party to GM...

Anyway, does anyone have suggestions for running The Forgotten Forge? I plan to follow it up with the Queen with the Burning Eyes, or whatever it is called, from Dungeon. Oh, and I have all three of the Eberron books.

Thanks,
Jason
 
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Old Fezziwig

Alive Again
I ran it as a PbP (link), and I inserted some hooks into future adventures and put in an encounter with a harpoon spider (part of an ambush set up by a group opposed to the party's plans). I found that it was a touch of a rough adventure — the fights that were already in it had the potential to be deadly (particularly as you get to the actual forge), and my party had to leave a few times to regroup. That said, my party's a bit nonstandard and is not optimized for combat (during the adventure, I had a Warforged Wiz1, Shifter Brb1, Human Clr1, and Gnome Art1). Things got nasty a few times.

Nick
 

Desdichado

Adventurer
John Q. Mayhem said:
It's rather too strong for the intended level, IMO.
I didn't find it so. We blew through it without too much trouble with a 4-member party including a shifter ranger 1, a warforged fighter 1, a human artificer 1 and a kalashtar rogue 1. Of course, I'm not sure exactly what our GM modified to make sure we didn't find it too hard, or maybe we're just good. ;)

For my money, my suggestions are to play up the intrique. Drop lots of hints and foreshadowing and make your players paranoid and unable to trust anyone. That's half the fun of that setting, in Sharn in particular. ;)
 

toberane

First Post
If it's the same one I played when we were playtesting the Forgotten Realms 3rd Ed, there is one CR10 monster in there that the players will have to watch out for. (Not going to say what it is, in case anyone gets around to playing it.)

The game designers put it in supposedly to show players that there is a time to fight and a time to run. Unfortuantely, by the time we had the opportunity to run, half of our party was unable to do so. Our party of 3rd level characters actually killed it, thanks to some extremely bad dice rolling on the DMs part and some quick thinking on ours, but it was just a fluke of luck. There is no way we should have been able to take this thing down.

I can remember a few other encounters we had difficulty with at 3rd level, one of which (much less potent than the CR10 I mentioned above) nearly ended in a TPK. I think if you are taking 1st level characters through it, some of the encounters will need to be modified or removed.

Certain things in the module may have changed, though, since we played a prerelease version of it.
 

Desdichado

Adventurer
Uh, the Forgotten Forge is included in the Eberron Campaign Setting. You couldn't possibly have playtested it with 3.0 FR unless by "playtest" you mean something completely different than most of the rest of us do. There's also no CR 10 creature that I remember facing.

Maybe you mean Forge of Fury or something else instead?
 


Joshua Dyal said:
Uh, the Forgotten Forge is included in the Eberron Campaign Setting. You couldn't possibly have playtested it with 3.0 FR unless by "playtest" you mean something completely different than most of the rest of us do. There's also no CR 10 creature that I remember facing.

Maybe you mean Forge of Fury or something else instead?

I'm pretty sure he's thinking The Forge of Fury, which would have been teseted back when.
 

jaults

First Post
Thanks for your input, guys. John Q. Mayhem, Care to share as to why you think it is too powerful as written? The only fight I can see as especially difficult (with a bit of luck and planning, of course) is the last one.

Thanks,
Jason
 

John Q. Mayhem

Explorer
'Cause it nearly killed the PCs I DMed it with :)

There're other factors to that, though. Bad rolling on theirs, good on "mine;" possibly them being inexperienced character creators, too. I'd have to look at it again, that's just a hazy recollection.
 

toberane

First Post
Joshua Dyal said:
Uh, the Forgotten Forge is included in the Eberron Campaign Setting. You couldn't possibly have playtested it with 3.0 FR unless by "playtest" you mean something completely different than most of the rest of us do. There's also no CR 10 creature that I remember facing.

Maybe you mean Forge of Fury or something else instead?

Forge of fury... That's it. OK, I look like an idiot now. :confused:
 


Saeviomagy

Adventurer
My suggestions:

1. Remove the sunrod from the markets. It just encourages players to NOT take sources of fire and flame into the forge, which means they can't defeat the bug swarm. Normally characters would go "heading into the darkness? We buy torches", but with the sunrod there, it's very tempting to just take a sunrod instead.

2. Change the doors on the forge to steel. Adamantine is just too expensive and valuable to be wasted on doors, especially doors in a first level adventure. Without a lot of DM intervention, and spontaeneously invented rules, it's pretty easy for first level characters to make a serious killing with the things. Additionally you want there to be SOME chance of the PC's fighting the two iron defenders within the forge - and that will happen if they're silly enough to bash the door in without scouting around first.
 


Old Fezziwig

Alive Again
Saeviomagy said:
2. Change the doors on the forge to steel. Adamantine is just too expensive and valuable to be wasted on doors, especially doors in a first level adventure. Without a lot of DM intervention, and spontaeneously invented rules, it's pretty easy for first level characters to make a serious killing with the things. Additionally you want there to be SOME chance of the PC's fighting the two iron defenders within the forge - and that will happen if they're silly enough to bash the door in without scouting around first.
I can see your point, but isn't the fact that it's so valuable kind of the point — it's an ancient forge that was extremely valuable to House Cannith. The adamantine kind of reinforces that idea. As for the PCs making a killing with the doors — how would they transport them? Who would help them? How would they pay the help? Would House Cannith and Lady Elaydren allow them to take the doors? As for the iron defenders, the PCs pretty much have to fight them in the forge anyhow. I'm not sure how changing the doors to steel changes that.

Nick
 

Saeviomagy

Adventurer
Kajamba Lion said:
I can see your point, but isn't the fact that it's so valuable kind of the point — it's an ancient forge that was extremely valuable to House Cannith. The adamantine kind of reinforces that idea. As for the PCs making a killing with the doors — how would they transport them? Who would help them? How would they pay the help?
Believe me, they'll do it. And stopping them from doing it will require a lot of the DM saying "no, that just won't work" without much in the way of justification. Much better just to, say, make the doors highly decorated, and assign a value to the decorations? Unless you really want the focus of the campaign to shift to "what do we do with these big valuable doors we have".
Would House Cannith and Lady Elaydren allow them to take the doors?
Apparently Lady Elaydren is so under-resourced that she has to ask a random group of adventurers from outside her house to investigate the place. How would they stop them?
As for the iron defenders, the PCs pretty much have to fight them in the forge anyhow. I'm not sure how changing the doors to steel changes that.
Unless the characters leap into the forge recklessly, then the encounter with the iron defenders can quickly become a matter of shooting fish in a barrel.
 

Glyfair

First Post
Saeviomagy said:
Believe me, they'll do it. And stopping them from doing it will require a lot of the DM saying "no, that just won't work" without much in the way of justification. Much better just to, say, make the doors highly decorated, and assign a value to the decorations? Unless you really want the focus of the campaign to shift to "what do we do with these big valuable doors we have".

Actually, I think players trying to get away with this certainly is the fuel for a number of adventures.

First, they have to figure out a way to break down the doors into a form they can carry through the narrow passages that lead to the area. Additionally, they have to decide how they are going to carry all that metal (in whatever form they end up with). They also are going to risk a lot of encounters in the area (you don't think other rats, swarms and the like won't wander into the area) during their "salvage" operation.

Second, they have to figure out how they are going to get it out of sewer level of Dorasharn tower. The inhabitants are very poor and anything that seems valuable enough for the attention the PCs pay to it is very likely to get their attention. It's not like they are going to be able to hide carry that amount of metal through the area. They are going to draw a lot of attention carrying that much through the area. Especially if they have to make several trips through the area.

Remember these are first level characters. The commoners in the area could give them a hard time, not to mention the rogues and warriors floating in the immediate area. Plus, the areas surrounding it aren't the highest class areas of Sharn, either.

Finally, they have to "fence" it. Almost anyone who would be interested in it will have ties to House Cannith. They are either going to be dealing with very, very questionable people, or else they are going to risk House Cannith finding out what they did. Making an enemy of House Cannith (even just the local branch) is really not something the PCs should be interested in doing. Doing so will make Sharn a very hot place for the PCs, and outside of Sharn isn't going to be cake, either.
 
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Glyfair

First Post
jaults said:
Thanks for your input, guys. John Q. Mayhem, Care to share as to why you think it is too powerful as written? The only fight I can see as especially difficult (with a bit of luck and planning, of course) is the last one.

Well, one thing that has caused problems before has been
the beetle swarm. Swarms are potentially very devastating to the party, if they aren't properly prepared.
 

Saeviomagy

Adventurer
Glyfair said:
Actually, I think players trying to get away with this certainly is the fuel for a number of adventures.
Which is great if you WANT to run an open-ended campaign. Unfortunately part of the premise of forgotten forge is to form the starting point for an ongoing themed campaign. Thus - adamantine doors derail your game.

Your points are all valid, but they would certainly stand out to the average player as "extraordinary measures that the DM had to go to to deprive us of our loot". Additionally, they're all things that can be overcome by canny players. It seems to be a lot of trouble to go to when simply making the doors iron will remove the possibility of the problem.
 

Glyfair

First Post
Saeviomagy said:
Which is great if you WANT to run an open-ended campaign. Unfortunately part of the premise of forgotten forge is to form the starting point for an ongoing themed campaign. Thus - adamantine doors derail your game.


In my experience, if you have players who are going to try to loot a set a adamantine doors, you are either going to run an open-ended game or they are going to derail your game often. Changing this is just going to push it further down the line.
 

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