Storytelling vs Roleplaying

[Doug McCrae]

I just got Spirit of the Century. On page 1 it says:

By roleplaying game, we mean a story-telling game which has several players.

Everyone apart from ExploderWizard seems to be using the wrong definitions of roleplaying game and storytelling game.

 

[lutecius]

I tend to agree with EW's definitions.

RPGs may include some storytelling mechanics and that alone doesn't make them not RPGs, they may even facilitate roleplaying.
But I don't think you're roleplaying while using them, just like I dont think number-crunching or even character creation are roleplaying (even though they're part of the game.)

And the more a game focuses on storytelling, the less it feels like an rpg to me.
Some indie designers might equate the two notions (some also claim narrativism is the most intuitive form of roleplaying) but to me they're clearly different things.

 

[Ariosto]

Thanks, Doug!
I pick up my papers and smile at the sky, for I know that the SotC never lies:

Diablo is a CSTG!

Hussar ("CRPGs like Diablo") will take note, I'm sure.

 

[darjr]

I tend to agree with EW's definitions.

RPGs may include some storytelling mechanics and that alone doesn't make them not RPGs, they may even facilitate roleplaying.
But I don't think you're roleplaying while using them, just like I dont think number-crunching or even character creation are roleplaying (even though they're part of the game.)

And the more a game focuses on storytelling, the less it feels like an rpg to me.
Some indie designers might equate the two notions (some also claim narrativism is the most intuitive form of roleplaying) but to me they're clearly different things.

But I think you are disagreeing with him. Those 'story' elements make it NOT a roleplaying game, as far as I understand his position.

 

[ExploderWizard]

But I think you are disagreeing with him. Those 'story' elements make it NOT a roleplaying game, as far as I understand his position.

While not purely a roleplaying game, SOTC certainly has some roleplaying elements and most likely opportunities for regular roleplaying during play. Mechanical elements that require players to operate outside thier roles are what make SOTC a storytelling game, not a complete absence of opportunity for roleplaying.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

I just got Spirit of the Century. On page 1 it says:

Everyone apart from ExploderWizard seems to be using the wrong definitions of roleplaying game and storytelling game.

Wait a moment, but they are saying they are a roleplaying game, of a kind as described in the following way How does this fit ExploderWizards definition? (Unless there is a new one I have missed.)

 

[maddman75]

While not purely a roleplaying game, SOTC certainly has some roleplaying elements and most likely opportunities for regular roleplaying during play. Mechanical elements that require players to operate outside thier roles are what make SOTC a storytelling game, not a complete absence of opportunity for roleplaying.

You can keep repeating this all you want, no one agrees with your definition. Personally, I don't see how using an Action Point mechanic to make my choices is significantly different from knowing what my Strength Score is. If you claim that characters 'know' about all these mechanics, games would all play like Order of the Stick comics.

 

[Obryn]

But I think you are disagreeing with him. Those 'story' elements make it NOT a roleplaying game, as far as I understand his position.

While not purely a roleplaying game, SOTC certainly has some roleplaying elements and most likely opportunities for regular roleplaying during play. Mechanical elements that require players to operate outside thier roles are what make SOTC a storytelling game, not a complete absence of opportunity for roleplaying.

So in other words, "Yes, you're right, SotC is not a Roleplaying Game"?

Or am I misunderstanding?

-O

 

[lutecius]

But I think you are disagreeing with him. Those 'story' elements make it NOT a roleplaying game, as far as I understand his position.

I also wrote:

the more a game focuses on storytelling, the less it feels like an rpg to me.

It's a matter of proportion. The threshold is probably different for each person.
The idea is that those story elements are not roleplaying.

 

[Ariosto]

DMG2 Excerpts: Ch. 2 Advanced Encounters

Your point?

It fails in a third way in that there are win conditions as a goal of the game.

It has a cute caboose, too!