D&D 5E Strixhaven: Curriculum of Chaos No Subclasses Confirmed by James Crawford

Paul Farquhar · Jul 19, 2021

Mind of tempest said:
so how would you gain more abilities? have two-level up systems is complex and unlikely to do well.

The Theros piety system already does this.

humble minion · Jul 19, 2021

Mind of tempest said:
I do not see a lot of safe options left for classes or subclasses other than more cleric domains

Really? I’m fairly sure I could come up with 20 subclass ideas off the top of my head without even thinking too hard. There’s still enormous scope left in the subclass design space I think. I hope wizards DO get more creative and risky in future, but I really don’t see ‘running out of concepts for subclasses’ as a bottleneck any time soon.

Mind of tempest · Jul 19, 2021

humble minion said:
Really? I’m fairly sure I could come up with 20 subclass ideas off the top of my head without even thinking too hard. There’s still enormous scope left in the subclass design space I think. I hope wizards DO get more creative and risky in future, but I really don’t see ‘running out of concord for subclasses’ as a bottleneck any time soon.

okay list them as I am not seeing a lot of safe options, I see plenty of experimental stuff available but they are not going that way hence my inability to come up with results.

humble minion · Jul 19, 2021

Mind of tempest said:
okay list them as I am not seeing a lot of safe options, I see plenty of experimental stuff available but they are not going that way hence my inability to come up with results.

a music-focused bard, college of troubadours?
an ancient dragon warlock patron
a fiend-blooded sorceror
an str/con based iron skin monk, focused on resisting/absorbing damage
a necromancy-based sorcerer
a circle of the plough Druid, who reveres farmlands amd fertility
a str-based brutal thug rogue
cleric domains of stone, secrets, beauty, cold, and harvest/agriculture
a golemcrafter wizard
a feral monk for creatures with natural weapons, that aims to bring oneself closer to the beast within
a fighter focused on forging magic weapons to use
a fast moving dervish barbarian who uses light or dual weapons
a plant-based Druid, who can wild shape into plant monsters, photosynthesise, etc
a paladin sworn to serve a nation or king

And I’m not even getting into setting-specific stuff or psionic or even getting particularly creative. I mean, the Rune Knight and the Circle of Stars Druid from Tasha’s seem to have been very well received, but I didn’t really see anyone clamouring for those niches to be filled beforehand.

Mind of tempest · Jul 19, 2021

humble minion said:
a music-focused bard, college of troubadours?

an ancient dragon warlock patron

a fiend-blooded sorceror

an str/con based iron skin monk, focused on resisting/absorbing damage

a necromancy-based sorcerer

a circle of the plough Druid, who reveres farmlands amd fertility

a str-based brutal thug rogue

cleric domains of stone, secrets, beauty, cold, and harvest/agriculture

a golemcrafter wizard

a feral monk for creatures with natural weapons, that aims to bring oneself closer to the beast within

a fighter focused on forging magic weapons to use

a fast moving dervish barbarian who uses light or dual weapons

a plant-based Druid, who can wild shape into plant monsters, photosynthesise, etc

a paladin sworn to serve a nation or king

And I’m not even getting into setting-specific stuff or psionic or even getting particularly creative. I mean, the Rune Knight and the Circle of Stars Druid from Tasha’s seem to have been very well received, but I didn’t really see anyone clamouring for those niches to be filled beforehand.

okay in order
1 how do they differ both mechanically and thematically from other bards?
2 this one is a no brainer and should be there already.
3 how do you make it not teifling default or hell warlock is the real question.
4 a that would make the monk even more MAD as abyss also why are all monk subclasses pure fighting styles it is kinda dull but could work would need some offence abilities to not be dull playing them.
5 how would they not just overlap with the necromancer or the two undead warlocks?
6 okay the thematic could work but what does it bring to the druid not presently there?
7 would be MAD as anything also other than stat change what does it bring?
8 that would need lots of spells being made first.
9 how would that even play?
10 overlaps a lot with the new barbarian subclass also how do we deal with it being unusable by phb races?
11 we have too many magic fighter subclasses as there are at this point we need the arcane gish just so people stop cluttering up the fighter.
12 okay but mechanically what does it add also we lack sufficient plant monster for that to work right now.
13 we already have it was in swords coast adventure guide.

define setting specific that is not just a slight variation of a present subclass?
psionics needs a full class first before we really make subclasses as at present they will just end up with more quarter casters.

consider both mechanical and thematic.

Micah Sweet · Jul 19, 2021

The thing that worries me about this exclusion is that it drastically curtails the amount of crunch in the book. Many people look at new content in terms of what they can adapt to their own games, and subclasses are a big part of that. What will this book actually have? One new race and a handful of feats?

Rabulias · Jul 19, 2021

Micah Sweet said:
The thing that worries me about this exclusion is that it drastically curtails the amount of crunch in the book. Many people look at new content in terms of what they can adapt to their own games, and subclasses are a big part of that. What will this book actually have? One new race and a handful of feats?

Spells and magic items might be useful in other games. There may also be some general rules (e.g., spell research, magic item creation, learning magical abilities, etc.) that could apply more broadly. I will definitely be looking at what can be used elsewhere before deciding to buy.

Dausuul · Jul 19, 2021

Paul Farquhar said:
But this uses D&D rules, and with D&D rules there are other ways to travel between planes, such as the Dream of the Blue Veil spell.

The question was, if Strixhaven has non-Arcavian students, why is every non-Arcavian student we know of a planeswalker? Answer: Because so far, all of our information on the student body comes from the Strixhaven Magic set, which follows M:tG lore, which means they have to be planeswalkers.

It's equivalent to saying "Anyone in Arcavia who isn't from Arcavia must have had a way to get to Arcavia from somewhere else." Trivially true, but hardly informative. Furthermore, Magic sets keep a lid on the number of planeswalkers for gameplay reasons, and Strixhaven was not designed as a "planeswalker set" (after War of the Spark, it will probably be quite a while before they do another of those), so the ratio of planeswalker to non-planeswalker cards doesn't necessarily represent anything in the lore.

Crimson Longinus · Jul 19, 2021

Micah Sweet said:
The thing that worries me about this exclusion is that it drastically curtails the amount of crunch in the book. Many people look at new content in terms of what they can adapt to their own games, and subclasses are a big part of that. What will this book actually have? One new race and a handful of feats?

Yep. This certainly has dropped my interest to the book from 'potentially interesting' to 'pass.'

PsyzhranV2 · Jul 19, 2021

Micah Sweet said:
The thing that worries me about this exclusion is that it drastically curtails the amount of crunch in the book. Many people look at new content in terms of what they can adapt to their own games, and subclasses are a big part of that. What will this book actually have? One new race and a handful of feats?

An expansion on D&D's social mechanics: