Infiniti2000
First Post
If you allow sudden maximize (or divine metamagic) without that restriction, you should expect to have to deal with these situations. Use the incantatrix rule for them or expect problems.Sporelock said:
Sudden Maxmized Explosive Runes
- Thread starter Sporelock
- Start date
Infiniti2000
First Post
No. I (and others) were commenting that there could be a level restriction (not a cost). Sudden metamagic (and divine metamagic) break the spell level restriction (creating upwards of 15th-level spells if you persist a 9th level spell). If unexpected, this creates problems.Nail said:Sudden Metamagic is *built* to be used without a level cost. You're saying it should have a(effective) level cost anyway?
Nail said:Now hold on:
Sudden Metamagic is *built* to be used without a level cost. You're saying it should have a
Makes perfect sense to me.
(The proposed house rule is that) if you want to be able to Sudden Maximize a spell, you need to be of sufficient level that you would be able to memorize the spell as a normal Maximized spell. So if you want to Sudden Maximize a Magic Missile, you have to be at least 7th level and have a 4th level spell slot available.
But even though that is the requirement of using the feat on that particular spell, you are still benefiting in that you only have to use a 1st level slot to actually cast the spell.
By which you mean to say, "When the ninth-level cleric was dropping one maximized flame strike per day on enemies, I -- how do you say -- nerfed that sucker"?Bad Paper said:
I can see a problem if there are few encounters every day, but as soon as he casts that spell, his character is just like every other 9th level cleric but with one fewer feats. It trades lasting effectiveness (like Spell Focus: Evocation) or character equippagement (Craft Wonderous Item) for one strong spell per day. Not in need of nerfing, I think.
well, I wouldn't require a 4th level slot open, just make sure the caster has one (and has Int 14, etc).Wolfwood2 said:
The cleric of whom I was thinking was actually using Divine Metamagic (maximize) and Extra Turning and all that happy crap (he is an extreme example), so when invoked Incantrix, I swept the Suddens under the same rug.Felix said:
You have a good point, though, in that the Suddens require one feat for one spell. It's not so broken, but I think I'll keep the Suddens where they are. I may be convinced one day to loosen up and maybe reduce the burden of the Suddens (e.g. Sudden Maximize would be equivalent to only a +2 level cost).
There's your problem.
The Sudden Metamagic feats really don't have much at all to do with Divine Metamagic because there is no way to increase the number of times you can do this per day; with Divine Metamagic, you can choose Extra Turning multiple times, increase your Charisma, and when a character is doing this sort of Maximizing five or six times a day, yes, it can get disruptive. But when he is strictly limited to once per day, you'll see quite a bit less abuse.
As for the Incantrix, I've neither seen this in play, nor even seen the class, so can't speak to its brokenness.
Let the Suddens go free; it's a good mechanism for being able to guarantee a black eye on the baddies once a day.
