D&D 5E Sudden Realization On Darkvision Wording

The real wonky thing is the warlock's Devil's Sight invocation.
Extinguish the candle, apprentice, so that we may See.

In my experience, the most misapplied rule is "disadvantage on Wisdom (Perception) checks in dim light". If I had a dollar for every time a player has asked "why am I at disadvantage, I have darkvision?" I'd be able to afford a steak dinner.
 

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pukunui

Legend
Extinguish the candle, apprentice, so that we may See.

In my experience, the most misapplied rule is "disadvantage on Wisdom (Perception) checks in dim light". If I had a dollar for every time a player has asked "why am I at disadvantage, I have darkvision?" I'd be able to afford a steak dinner.
I made sure to apply that rule when one of my players took the Dungeon Delver feat to get advantage on checks to spot traps and secret doors. (We're playing Dungeon of the Mad Mage, so there are a lot of both.)

I pointed out that if he's relying on his PC's darkvision to see, then the dim light will impose disadvantage that cancels out the feat's advantage. In order for him to be able to benefit from the feat, his PC will need to have a light source ... so no sneaking around in the dark automatically finding all the traps and secret doors thank you very much!

(Of course, if the warlock had taken the feat, that would be another matter ...)
 

Methinks the OP was confusing the mechanics of Darkvision, which is just 60’, with the mechanics of the Light Spell, which specifies 20’ bright and 20’ beyond that dim.
 

Charlaquin

Goblin Queen (She/Her/Hers)
How is that substantially different than now with different referees having different misunderstandings about how darkvision actually works?
Darkvision is a fictional magical ability with its function clearly defined by the game rules. Infravision is a vaguely-defined mechanic based on a real scientific phenomenon that people commonly misunderstand, and then make poor game rulings based on those real-world misunderstandings. Also, again with it being more of a pain to adjudicate.
 

overgeeked

B/X Known World
Darkvision is a fictional magical ability with its function clearly defined by the game rules.
Not clearly enough to avoid confusion among fans. Clearly. Since there’s constant references to people not understanding or not applying the rules for darkvision.
Infravision is a vaguely-defined mechanic based on a real scientific phenomenon that people commonly misunderstand, and then make poor game rulings based on those real-world misunderstandings. Also, again with it being more of a pain to adjudicate.
I’ve seen far more misunderstanding around 5E’s darkvision than infravision. 5E’s been out, what 10 years while AD&D’s been out, what 45-47 years. Still more confusion over darkvision.

AD&D PHB p102. “nfravision is the ability to see into the infrared spectrum. Thus heat radiation becomes visible and differences in temperature allow infrared sight. Warm things are bright, cool things grey, very cold things are black. Most infravision extends to 60' distance. Dungeon-dwelling monsters have infravision to 120'. All infravision is spoiled if a light source is shedding illumination upon the creature possessing the infrared sight capability. Similarly, great heat will spoil the capability.

Thieves hiding in shadows are successful with respect to infravision only if there is a heat/light source nearby to mask their body heat, or a very cold object or radiation to provide similar cover.”

This is further detailed in the DMG, on page 59.

“You see heat. Watch Predator* or clips on YouTube. You’ll get it.”

* Although Predator even gets it wrong because the mud doesn’t warm as it sits on Ahnuld’s pecks.

It’s nowhere near as hard as people make it out to be.
 

MarkB

Legend
Not clearly enough to avoid confusion among fans. Clearly. Since there’s constant references to people not understanding or not applying the rules for darkvision.

I’ve seen far more misunderstanding around 5E’s darkvision than infravision. 5E’s been out, what 10 years while AD&D’s been out, what 45-47 years. Still more confusion over darkvision.

AD&D PHB p102. “nfravision is the ability to see into the infrared spectrum. Thus heat radiation becomes visible and differences in temperature allow infrared sight. Warm things are bright, cool things grey, very cold things are black. Most infravision extends to 60' distance. Dungeon-dwelling monsters have infravision to 120'. All infravision is spoiled if a light source is shedding illumination upon the creature possessing the infrared sight capability. Similarly, great heat will spoil the capability.

Thieves hiding in shadows are successful with respect to infravision only if there is a heat/light source nearby to mask their body heat, or a very cold object or radiation to provide similar cover.”

This is further detailed in the DMG, on page 59.

“You see heat. Watch Predator* or clips on YouTube. You’ll get it.”

* Although Predator even gets it wrong because the mud doesn’t warm as it sits on Ahnuld’s pecks.

It’s nowhere near as hard as people make it out to be.
I'm confused already. Does it only let you see creatures and torches? Can you use it to navigate in an environment that lacks major temperature gradients? Are undead and constructs invisible to infravision? Does moonlight count as a light source shedding light on the creature possessing infravision? Does it provide enough detail to let you recognise an individual?
 

overgeeked

B/X Known World
Assuming these are asked in good faith.
Does it only let you see creatures and torches?
No. You see heat. Anything that's a significantly different temperature than the ambient heat level would stand out.
Can you use it to navigate in an environment that lacks major temperature gradients?
Nope. If everything's the same temperature, it would all blend together. What you see in most infrared or thermal images is a combination of image enhancement and thermal imaging. Without that image enhancement, everything that's the same temperature would blend together.
Are undead and constructs invisible to infravision?
Only if their temperature doesn't vary significantly from the ambient temperature. The more they move, the more they'd heat up (if real-world physics applies), so things like feet that scrape against the floor, joints that move, etc would stand out.
Does moonlight count as a light source shedding light on the creature possessing infravision?
The moon reflects light and heat. It doesn't mess with infrared goggles, but no idea if it would mess with someone with infravision. This might be where Gary messed up.
Does it provide enough detail to let you recognise an individual?
If you had identical twins in the same clothes you couldn't tell them apart, but you'd still see things like the shape of clothes, outlines, height difference, body shape, body type, etc.
 


The real wonky thing is the warlock's Devil's Sight invocation. Unlike actual devils, who can simply see through all kinds of darkness, warlocks get to see normally in full darkness. So if the lighting is dim, they have to put up with it being dim. It's only if it's pitch black and then all of a sudden they can see as if everything was brightly lit and in full color.

(I have a player who loves to use the Devil's Sight plus darkness combo. His current PC is a half-elf, so she can basically ignore dim light as well, but the whole Devil's Sight thing can be weird. The PC also happens to have a sentient sword with Truesight ...)
Even in that case, they still have a weird thing where if there's a dim light source around them they can see better at long range than short range. Or a torch would give three bands: see fine 20', see poorly 20' more, then see fine for another 80'.
 

ezo

I cast invisibility
I'm confused already.
Ok...

Does it only let you see creatures and torches?
No. You can see everything within the range. All objects and creatures vary in temperature from the things around them, even if only minimally.

Can you use it to navigate in an environment that lacks major temperature gradients?
Yes. As long as there are any temperature gradiants, you notice it. If there is no difference in temperature, then effectively everything would be the same color and blend together, effectively making your infravision ineffective.

Are undead and constructs invisible to infravision?
No, you can see them unless they are precisely the same temperature as the ambient temperature around them. VERY rarely would anything like this happen unless artificially created.

Does moonlight count as a light source shedding light on the creature possessing infravision?
Sadly, yes, since the range of moonlight is effectively infinite. Infravision really only helps in areas of complete darkness.

I knew some DMs who would rule moonlight wasn't intense enough to spoil infravision, but for me it was always an "all or nothing" thing. Which is why it is mostly associated with dungeon-dwelling creatures--things living in complete darkness.

Does it provide enough detail to let you recognise an individual?
As much detail as you could derive depending on how close you are to the person, sure.

Could we ask why do Elfs who live in daylightbget any kind of darkvision at all?

Why not just +1 Perception?
Because elves do a lot of their celebrations during the night, especially under moonlight, etc.?

Otherwise, it is a carry over from earlier versions. 🤷‍♂️
 

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