systems without levels or hp's

[focallength]

there are a ton of non-maistream games that dont use hp or levels (progression that is)
I found that most games that are based our current era (give or take a few hundred years) especially post apoc. and futuristic games like shadow run and cyber punk, record your progress through skill advancement and "gear" just go to a well stocked game shop and browse through lesser known games like shadowrun, cyberpunk, twighlight 2000, most cowboy era games, morrow project (an awesome game if you can find it BUY IT!) star wars, Warhammer roleplay (the old editions anyway, not sure on the current), Earthdawn (shadowrun style fantasy), mechwarrior,and tons more, these games focus on skill progression and you pretty much always have the same "hitpoints", armor and not getting hit is what keeps you alive.

 

[focallength]

Oh god traveller, lets spend 6 hours creating a character another 4 hours creating weapons, 18 hours making a ship, better hope you got someone who's got a doctorate in physics and a masters in mathematics, if not triple all those times. "OH NO WERE BEING ATTACKED! ok everyone call in sick for the rest of the week, were gonna be here a while". "Grandaddy of games" is right, youll be a grandaddy by the time your done with your first adventure.

 

[SWBaxter]

Can anyone recommend some systems that don't use levels or hp's?

One that I picked up relatively recently and am coming to really like is The Riddle of Steel. Very interesting system. Damage is tracked via wounds, which have various negative effects on your character.

Another one that I like is HeroQuest, though I'm not that thrilled with the Glorantha setting. It's relatively easy to adapt to just about any other setting, luckily enough. A non-Glorantha version of the rules, QuestWorlds, is apparently coming some time this year.

The new World of Darkness games (Vampire: the Requiem, Werewolf: the Forsaken) are also very good so far; I didn't much like the old ones due to confused mechanics and the overarching metaplot, but the mechanics at least are much cleaner now. The system has some wonkiness to it, but overall it's not bad at all.

If you're a d6 Star Wars fan, the d6 system was released as a generic base system last year, along with at least three settings (Fantasy, Science Fiction, and Pulp adventure, I believe). It's gotten some pretty decent reviews.

 

[focallength]

on the plus side it is fun to whomp on some low tech world with tactical neucular fighting knives, phaserlaserparticle pistols, sharp sticks and foul language.

 

[SWBaxter]

Oh god traveller, lets spend 6 hours creating a character another 4 hours creating weapons, 18 hours making a ship, better hope you got someone who's got a doctorate in physics and a masters in mathematics, if not triple all those times.

Why do people who've obviously never even read a game feel compelled to comment on it? One of the great mysteries of EN World, I guess. Since I actually have played Traveller, a little reality check: the rules part of creating character takes maybe 15 minutes on average, and the most complicated calculation you have to do during that time is add together two numbers ranging from 1 to 6. Weapons are generally taken from an equipment list. On the off chance a group starts with a ship, it'll be a standard type detailed in the rules. When I went to university, you didn't generally get a doctorate for successfully reading 2d6 and picking stuff from lists, maybe things are different nowadays.

 

[Patman21967]

Any version of RuneQuest, but I like Chaosiums..RuneQuest II. There are no classes, levels, and your HP are divided per body part, based on your Con and a few other mods...It is a d100 system, for the most part. I really think it is the best system ever done. Overall, RuneQuest II, if you play it in Glorantha and during the Lunar-Sartar wars, is the best game ever put out...shame it was mainly played in England and Oz. We had a 10 year campaign, that was the most memorable game, for me, in 25 years of gaming.

 

[Patman21967]

Why do people who've obviously never even read a game feel compelled to comment on it? One of the great mysteries of EN World, I guess. Since I actually have played Traveller, a little reality check: the rules part of creating character takes maybe 15 minutes on average, and the most complicated calculation you have to do during that time is add together two numbers ranging from 1 to 6. Weapons are generally taken from an equipment list. On the off chance a group starts with a ship, it'll be a standard type detailed in the rules. When I went to university, you didn't generally get a doctorate for successfully reading 2d6 and picking stuff from lists, maybe things are different nowadays.

You can really tell the generation gap between gamers...I used to love Traveller. We played many "shits and giggles" Traveller games, and a few serious ones too. I had a Ships Captain named Ace McGirt, who was the typical coked up, hot-shot space cowboy...never met a ship he couldn't fly. a woman he couldn't bed, a gun he couldn't shoot or a civilization he couldn't ruin. Pirate, Smuggler, Ship for Hire....Geez guys, thanks for bringing back so many fond memories of the wonderful 80's

 

[Psion]

Oh god traveller, lets spend 6 hours creating a character another 4 hours creating weapons, 18 hours making a ship, better hope you got someone who's got a doctorate in physics and a masters in mathematics, if not triple all those times. "OH NO WERE BEING ATTACKED! ok everyone call in sick for the rest of the week, were gonna be here a while". "Grandaddy of games" is right, youll be a grandaddy by the time your done with your first adventure.

Warning to onlookers: the above quoted post should be taken as a grain of salt, as it contains more than a slight bit of hyperbole, exagarations, and/or outright distortions.

That is all.

 

[der_kluge]

I don't mind hit points, but not I'm a big fan of d20's linear hit point curve. That is where you put a 20th level guy in the guillotine, but the blade only does 10 points of damage, and he has 200 hit points, so you have to slam it down on him at least a good 20 times before his head gets cut off!

I like it in HARP where "hits" are a skill and can be purchased (or neglected!) and combat is lethal for even the highest level party. And it's plausible that a 1st level character could slay an unarmored 20th level individual with one good hit.

 

[Thanee]

Can anyone recommend some systems that don't use levels or hp's?

Midgard (altho, it has both levels and hit points, they are done in a way, very much unlike D&D), but the problem is, it is available in german only.

Bye
Thanee