Tell Me About the Cypher System

[The Soloist]

We played Numenera for about 6 sessions when it came out. I had read Vance's Dying Earth books and Gene Wolf's Sun books. I enjoyed the setting more than the system.

I don't see myself playing Cypher System.

Well, never say never! I am currently GMing the Cypher System with the Predation setting. We've played 5 sessions so far and everyone is enjoying it. I'm in a different mindset than I was when Numenera came out. It helps that his group is better attuned to the Cypher system.

 

[RenleyRenfield]

Do you do a lot of flex/improv in the storytelling aspects of play? I found intrusions get the most used when it comes to narrative advancement and providing exciting details and advancements. I like to equate intrusions as "that thing that unexpectedly happens in the movie you are watching....that's an intrusion." Examples include: Indiana Jones plucks the golden idol and replaces it with a bag of sand; the GM plays an intrusion at that point to reveal the bag was not weighted enough; Princess Leia's player plays a player intrusion to reveal a nearby access grate actually opens up into an escape chute when she blasts it (and the GM plays an intrusion to reveal it goes to a garbage compactor), etc. etc.

Well.... so we left/let Intrusions to occur only on a roll of 1 (GM) or 20 (Player who rolled.)
And so it happens 5% ish of the time, however that plays out for a given game sessions number of rolls.
These Intrusions are pretty major and have narrative weight. Honestly, this number of times it activates is perfect, not too much, but not rare either.

Two examples are =

player Intrusion base (anyone can do) =

Add to the Fiction​

You can add some item or feature to the location which is plausible to the fiction and useful to them as an Asset.

archetype Intrusion (only your archetype can do this on a 20) =

Inspirational Recall​

You recall an important detail from a previous encounter (perhaps something you don't even remember noticing at the time) that suggests a successful course of action for your current situation. This might be recognizing a password hidden in an innocuous code or riddle, realizing you saw a suspicious individual near a crime scene, overhearing an important conversation between two NPCs, or understanding that an NPC's subtle glance or gesture had additional connotations indicating what you should do.

...
So yeah, these are pretty good at advancing the fiction, and giving the player a chance to add to the scene what everyone thinks makes sense. And they give some context or texture to the intrusion such that players can improv things easily.

.....
For the GM things are the same but also, since Cypher is PBTA in D&D shoes... we just listed the PBTA MC moves as what a G can do when the players roll a 1 and the GM gets to add an Intrusion. So you would see the GM get a thing like "On an GM intrusion you can do..."

Example A =

OFFER A HOOK​

Think about the strengths and proclivities of the individual party members, and choose one as the basis. Then give them a new clue on a hook where there was not one before – that puts them in even greater danger should they go for it. Its benefit must be real and useful, make the bait worth the pain!
....

THEN we have FLASHBACKS which cost Pool =
When you feel it’s time to trigger a Flashback, narrate what you need and consult the chart to see how much Intellect pool you must spend. Then roleplay out the Flashback, making an Action rolls as needed, and if it’s a Leave action you spend Gil required.

Spend Condition
1 An ordinary action for which you had easy opportunity or somewhat useful item.

3 A complex action or unlikely opportunity or basic useful item

6 An elaborate action involving special opportunities or contingencies or an item that is exactly what you need/rare

...
Flashbacks act like mini-intrusions. Allowing players to act as if their character is more thoughtful, prepared, or competent in the moment. And it reduces dithering planning time since you can always spend Pool to flashback to preparations or having found the key ahead of time or whatever.

...

Lastly, oh YES, our group improvs a LOT!! For every pool spend = comes with roleplay, dialog, reasons, etc....

 

[Thomas Shey]

I used to worry about this too, and for a long time I didn't play Numenera or Cypher because of it. When I finally "saw the light" and embraced the design I found this was actually a non issue, and after several campaigns under my belt I would never mess with it; the dynamic of the point pool and letting players weigh and play the odds is critical to how the system works.

The latter can still be both true and undesirable. The fact some people like it (which is clearly the case, there's no lack of Cypher fans) does not make me feel differently in that regard.

 

[RenleyRenfield]

Glad you have fond memories, at least. Pity, you've taken my request to provide data negatively - or at least that's how I perceived your reaction. Still, thank you for taking your time to share.

To anyone else reading this, could you provide a Cypher system encounter example where using more effort to succeed is more beneficial than using minimum effort?

Oh hey I might be able to help with that...

Although... I'm not 100% sure what you mean by "use minimum effort"???

I am of the opinion that yeah, spend as little Pool as possible in all things. Rolling a d20 to get 12+ to take 4 harm, versus spending 3 pool to roll on a 9+ = not worth it!

most people ask at that point = "then what is the point of pool at all?" Well...

• When the damage you are about to take is 2 or 3 times or more than the pool you spend to not get hit would be... (typically 10+ damage threat)
• When you want to avoid Hazard damage (that's stuff like being on fire, poisoned, acid, etc) = stuff that does 1 to 6 points of harm every round!!!
• When the fiction would be disaster (i.e. roll to protect the prince, fail and he gets shot in the face and killed and you lose you gained in the kingdom... oh dear!)
• when the pool damage in to a weak pool of yours. There are things that do speed or intellect damage. Not good taking Impaired or Debilitated when you have just begun your adventure...

Now check this, characters are allowed only +1 Effort and Edge per Tier. So at Tier 6 your Effort and Edge are likely 6. But.....
Enemies go to TN 30 (if the GM really loves you).

So a Tier 6 character, going against a true tier 6 threat one on one of say.... TN24... even with 2 free ease that needs a 18 or higher to succeed, and you can be your butt that thing is gonna to 15+ pool damage! = you gonna die.

So Cypher kinda feels logarithmic in its power growth... where at some point, in order to not die = you must spend pool all the time, and likely have very needed cyphers, and very good gear. It get's more epic and BIG, but not...easy... (and yeah, a tier 6 going against some TN 6 baddies = gonna bet hot knife through a goose, or however that phrase goes

And all of that is just combat, there is sooooo much more to spend pool on than Combat...
.....

Also note = Cypher is a pulp adventure game! So pool isn't just "how much can you handle in one combat." = recovery time does get debilitating, and healing cyphers run out. A good dungeon crawl (the core of what Numena made cypher for), can be a "slow drain" on your Pools.... so that's great. You can adventure for a while on your own merit, but a GM will whittle you down (with a few smash hits from Intrusions to keep you on your toes.

I agree with folks who say "the pools and effort and all that works when at the table and playing over a few months" ... like.... we have been playing it for years now, and with a few tweaks (see my FF8 cypher hack) = it more or less has the same amount of live, hurt, explore, act = that D&D does. It just also offers more player agency to act clever on top of that.

Also note = Cypher demands more dynamic GM encounters. Bandits on the side of the road should be prepared, set traps, and after your characters are exhausted on the road, and after the exhausting river fording, and after the snap frost storm, and after the thunder night of no sleep.... like... Dear Cypher GM = make the world constantly alive, a threat, and interesting (plus shower the players is Cyphers! all the Cyphers! All the time! make that extra mile of wilderness exploration worth it for more goodies! oops all loot crates at the end of the tunnel! lol)

 

[ruemere]

I am just joining a Cypher system game so I am new to the system but it sounds like any time the opponent hits really hard you want to either spend points on defense to avoid the bigger pool cost damage, spend points on offense to take them out quicker so you take less big hit damages in the combat, or both if you can, all over just doing the minimum of your unenhanced attacks with no pool spent on defense and taking damage.

Mathematically if the damage outweighs the cost of defense points it is advantageous to spend on the defense points.

The devil is in the details. Also, some people would prefer to know the odds prior to committing.

Still, thanks for offering an opinion.

 

[RenleyRenfield]

The devil is in the details. Also, some people would prefer to know the odds prior to committing.

If you are talking about being able to spend pool After the roll = I 100% agree. We moved to that rule and players have a lot more fun with waying the pros and cons of pool use. Works better too for social play, where they can make the roll and spend to ask more questions and learn more details!