D&D 5E The "General Nature" of a Trap

[Eyes of Nine]

Are we talking yet bout how in 2014 5e (not sure about 2024) there isn't a special feat for rogues specifically for finding traps? It's not actually called out anywhere specifically afaik - maybe in the detail section on Investigation checks?

 

[EzekielRaiden]

So I was reading Find Traps. Both the 2014 and the 2024 version have similar descriptions of what the spell does, but do you find them as vague as I do?

2024: "This spell reveals that a trap is present but not its location. You do learn the general nature of the danger posed by a trap you sense."

2014: "This spell merely reveals that a trap is present. You don't learn the location of each trap, but you do learn the general nature of the danger posed by a trap you sense."

So the spell lets you know a trap is present within 120 feet and in your line of sight, but not exactly where it is, but does tell you its "general nature?"

What does "general nature" mean to you? Do you know if it does damage, type of damage, what sets it off, magical or mechanical, etc?

Let us imagine a tall set of stairs mechanically trapped to collapse into a slide as oil pours from the top and a spiked pit opens at the bottom when the weight of at least 2 medium size creatures get past the 15th step.

What is the "general nature" of that trap?

How would you/do you rule it?

To me, "general nature" would describe:

1. Whether there is only one trap, or multiple, but not the exact number
2. Generally what harm might be done to you (crushing, shooting, cutting, etc.)
3. Whether (but not how) the trap(s) had been designed to be evaded, or must be disarmed; if multiple traps, answer may be ambiguous
4. Whether this was part of the original architecture, or added later; as before, answer may be ambiguous

I think that gives a strong, useful description of the "general nature" of the situation. Given it's both a 2nd level spell and a divination, which many players are reluctant to "waste" spells on, I feel this is reasonably warranted while still preserving the value of skill rolls. You still need to actually figure out what the trap(s) might be and how to disarm/evade whatever might be present...and even if you disarm one trap out of "multiple", you don't know if there's another one or two etc., which you'd need an actual trap expert for.

The spell saves time and allows an actual skill user (ideally an expert!) to focus their efforts productively, but still depends on those efforts to accomplish something.

 

[aco175]

I think having a general nature of the trap would warrant advantage on disarming it, but the spell does not seem to say that.

I guess it depends on how much you roleplay a trap. The DM could be asking things like:
Do you touch the statue?
Show me where you are standing.
How do you open the chest.
What part of the desk are you looking at? Do you open the drawer?

Or, the DM could just be, make an Investigation check, or Perception depending.

 

[Shardstone]

Something else I am just now realizing about this spell, it is not an ongoing detection type spell. The duration is "instantaneous." Thus, you need to already have a pretty good idea there might be a trap around and in what direction to look when you cast it.

I've been rewriting a bunch of spells for my VF5E project and this one just moved to the top of the list.

Its for casting when you enter a suspicious room or area. Should be a cantrip imo.

 

[Reynard]

Its for casting when you enter a suspicious room or area. Should be a cantrip imo.

If it was a cantrip players would just spam it.

Also, what's NOT a suspicious room in a dungeon?

 

[MarkB]

Make it a concentration-based cantrip that lasts a long time (call it an hour, but you can just re-cast it). When you get within a certain range of a trap, say 30 feet, you get a 'pulse' alerting you to its presence, but you gain no information as to its nature or location. You can choose to find its exact location and general mechanism by spending a spell slot, with tougher traps requiring higher-level slots to reveal.

 

[TaranTheWanderer]

Make it a concentration-based cantrip that lasts a long time (call it an hour, but you can just re-cast it). When you get within a certain range of a trap, say 30 feet, you get a 'pulse' alerting you to its presence, but you gain no information as to its nature or location. You can choose to find its exact location and general mechanism by spending a spell slot, with tougher traps requiring higher-level slots to reveal.

It doesn’t need to be a cantrip but it should have a duration longer than instantaneous.

That is the biggest problem with it: when shall we cast it? How about now? Oh, no traps here, spell wasted.

If it lasted an hour you could cast it at the opening of a dungeon and it would be semi-useful. Even if it were concentration.

 

[TaranTheWanderer]

I think having a general nature of the trap would warrant advantage on disarming it, but the spell does not seem to say that.

I guess it depends on how much you roleplay a trap. The DM could be asking things like:
Do you touch the statue?
Show me where you are standing.
How do you open the chest.
What part of the desk are you looking at? Do you open the drawer?

Or, the DM could just be, make an Investigation check, or Perception depending.

I don’t like to prompt the players like that. It makes them suspicious- even if there isn’t a trap. I just describe the room and, if they ask to search for traps, I ask them:
1. Where they are searching
2. What are they looking for?
3. What are they doing?

Not that I belabour it. But if they’re in a room and they say, “I want to search the desk”

“what are you looking for? And what part of the desk are you searching?”

“Traps and looking for false bottoms. I’ll check the locks for needles and see if there are any runes using arcana. ”

If there’s a pressure plate on the floor beside the desk that triggers when they move the desk chair, they might not find it unless they roll way better than the dc. And trigger it if they roll badly enough (because they accidentally interacted with it. ) If they mention looking for pressure plates under the chair, they don’t even roll.

The spell would give them an idea there is a trap around there and they would approach more carefully and probably check the floor around before even checking the desk. Maybe.

Although now that I write all that. Sometimes they say, “I check the desk for traps” and I just check their passive investigation and give them an answer. So what am I even talking about?

 

[Shardstone]

If it was a cantrip players would just spam it.

Also, what's NOT a suspicious room in a dungeon?

I think thats fine. Make it have a duration of one hour and have it turn off after the first ping. No different then spamming light.

 

[Micah Sweet]

I think thats fine. Make it have a duration of one hour and have it turn off after the first ping. No different then spamming light.

Spamming light isn't to everyone's taste in the game either.