The Great D&D Schism: The End of an age and the scattering of gamers

[Cadence]

Oh you don't remember this condescending abomination of an ad?

Gack. I'm not sure if I want that to actually have been put together by WotC or not...

 

[XunValdorl_of_Kilsek]

Oh you don't remember this condescending abomination of an ad?

[video=youtube;qyR2L-t87b4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qyR2L-t87b4[/video]

Spot on!

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Oh you don't remember this condescending abomination of an ad?

[video=youtube;qyR2L-t87b4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qyR2L-t87b4[/video]

Can someone tell me what is wrong with this ad? I thought it was funny and showed editions through the years

 

[XunValdorl_of_Kilsek]

Can someone tell me what is wrong with this ad? I thought it was funny and showed editions through the years

If you have to ask then you need to really watch the ad again.

 

[Remus Lupin]

Can someone tell me what is wrong with this ad? I thought it was funny and showed editions through the years

Try looking at it from the perspective of someone who likes 3rd edition, and needs to be convinced that 4th edition is actually going to be an improvement worth coming over for (i.e., me at the time the ad came out -- and note that it failed to accomplish that objective, with me at least).

 

[Derren]

Can someone tell me what is wrong with this ad? I thought it was funny and showed editions through the years

Apart from the overall quality it for example depicts D&D gamers as too stupid as to remember a simple game rule. Also, even the option of grapple itself is ridiculed by that silly "hugging" image they show.

 

[Ahnehnois]

Beyond that, I think the ad commits the cardinal sin of saying nothing of substance about the thing that it is advertising. Of course, it's implied that the new game will have better rules, but it doesn't actually say that, it just criticizes the old ones.

 

[Obryn]

I miss when we were all on the same page, more or less. I miss when I could talk D&D online or in meatspace and not have to ignore half the conversations because I genuinely dislike the edition they are talking about, or when I could walk into my FLGS and actually see books I wanted to buy. I haven't bought a D&D book in about 6 years, because they stopped making anything I'd want to buy.

I know I'm responding to the OP, but this seems like rose-colored glasses. By the time 4e came out, I was already done with 3.5. I'd grown extremely disappointed with the ruleset as a whole; the time had passed when I could overlook its flaws for its perks. I didn't like the game anymore, and I still don't.

There's no magical scenario where 4e didn't exist where I'd still be playing 3.5. Perhaps I wouldn't be gaming at all, or perhaps I would have moved away from D&D and played all these other great games that are around which lack such toxicity.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

If you have to ask then you need to really watch the ad again.

I have, I even did watch it again before posting and still don't see anything wrong...

Try looking at it from the perspective of someone who likes 3rd edition, and needs to be convinced that 4th edition is actually going to be an improvement worth coming over for (i.e., me at the time the ad came out -- and note that it failed to accomplish that objective, with me at least).

I can't see it still, I loved 2e, and I make jokes about thac0 and unintuitive initiative all the time... so Those jokes were right on.
The only 3e 'joke' was going through the book looking for an obscure sub set of rules... something that we saw all the time and didn't see anything wrong with then or now... although I don't think 4e was entirely without that problem (because printing out cards for each rule is not better) I still don't see anything wrong.

Apart from the overall quality it for example depicts D&D gamers as too stupid as to remember a simple game rule. Also, even the option of grapple itself is ridiculed by that silly "hugging" image they show.

Well I guess I am stupid then. I could not in 2002, 2003,2004,or 2007 do any of the following with out opening a book... Disarm, Grapple, Trip, Sunder... to this day even after watching that video I do not know what steps 2-4 are on the grapple rules, but because I just watched it like 3 times I know it starts with an opp attack.

Maybe I was just the target audience for the commercial and as such loved it (although I could go with out the French accent)

Beyond that, I think the ad commits the cardinal sin of saying nothing of substance about the thing that it is advertising. Of course, it's implied that the new game will have better rules, but it doesn't actually say that, it just criticizes the old ones.

It was basically a teaser... so it focused not on the best of each edition but the worst.



now to all four of you, have you never seen any of that in play?

by the way I have seen erasers as minis, and even "hey what does that represent" being something just fallen on the table, and everyone pulling out books to search normally ends with "Guys page XX" then everyone turning to it. And that was not just 3e, but 2e with options (especially combat and tactics) and World of Darkness (even worse when you need to read 3 paragraphs of flavor text with rules hidden within) and Rifts... the searchable databse of rules for 4e on my iPhone was a little bit better... not much.

 

[XunValdorl_of_Kilsek]

I have, I even did watch it again before posting and still don't see anything wrong...

I can't see it still, I loved 2e, and I make jokes about thac0 and unintuitive initiative all the time... so Those jokes were right on.
The only 3e 'joke' was going through the book looking for an obscure sub set of rules... something that we saw all the time and didn't see anything wrong with then or now... although I don't think 4e was entirely without that problem (because printing out cards for each rule is not better) I still don't see anything wrong.


Well I guess I am stupid then. I could not in 2002, 2003,2004,or 2007 do any of the following with out opening a book... Disarm, Grapple, Trip, Sunder... to this day even after watching that video I do not know what steps 2-4 are on the grapple rules, but because I just watched it like 3 times I know it starts with an opp attack.

Maybe I was just the target audience for the commercial and as such loved it (although I could go with out the French accent)


It was basically a teaser... so it focused not on the best of each edition but the worst.



now to all four of you, have you never seen any of that in play?

by the way I have seen erasers as minis, and even "hey what does that represent" being something just fallen on the table, and everyone pulling out books to search normally ends with "Guys page XX" then everyone turning to it. And that was not just 3e, but 2e with options (especially combat and tactics) and World of Darkness (even worse when you need to read 3 paragraphs of flavor text with rules hidden within) and Rifts... the searchable databse of rules for 4e on my iPhone was a little bit better... not much.

I'm not trying to be a prick when I say this, but are you honestly reading what is being presented and watching what we are watching?

The point was that WoTc tried to make other editions such as 3rd edition into being crap while 4th edition was supposed to be this "state of the art bit of fresh air".