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D&D 5E The implications of Basic 5E: An adventure-based approach?

DEFCON 1

Legend
Supporter
Personally, I would prefer to get more short* modules so that I could mix and match as I wanted. This way I could create a pseudo-sandbox. I don't like to run adventure paths because they often feel railroady and I feel constrained as a DM (and as a player if I am playing in one).

*32 to 64 pages is pretty nice. It makes it much easier to just pick up a module with minimal preparation time and start a campaign.

I would be willing to bet that these sorts of short modules will be found in the online Dungeon Magazine that they start back up through DDI. They'll use the very large multi-part printed adventures for Encounters, Expeditions, and Epics (which will probably include setting material within them) and produce a couple series per year... and then put the shorter one-off stuff in the magazine for subscription.
 

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Wrathamon

Adventurer
The longer adventures have done very well for Paizo; one can only assume that, if they’re written well, they’ll also do well for Wizards.

I think the Subscription model might be something that works ... I know I have never bought an adventure path on its own since canceling my sub. When I had my sub, I didnt care what I got ... I dont have any data. I cancelled cause of $ issues and I didnt like one of the adventure paths but since then I havent busted out my wallet to buy a new one.

It's the fitness club model or wow sub .... its a hassle to cancel and you forget about it. Oh look I got something cool in the mail this month.
 

MerricB

Eternal Optimist
Supporter
I think the Subscription model might be something that works ... I know I have never bought an adventure path on its own since canceling my sub. When I had my sub, I didnt care what I got ... I dont have any data. I cancelled cause of $ issues and I didnt like one of the adventure paths but since then I havent busted out my wallet to buy a new one.

It's the fitness club model or wow sub .... its a hassle to cancel and you forget about it. Oh look I got something cool in the mail this month.

Subscription models are awesome for this sort of thing, especially if they have a discount attached. I know that's a major reason why I have a lot of Paizo products, despite it being a system I don't particularly enjoy.

It is also worth noting that Paizo also make it harder to unsubscribe than to subscribe.

Cheers!
 

Rygar

Explorer
@Rygar is completely right, and a smart guy to boot since I've been saying the same thing for a year now and the mark of a smart person is someone who agree with me :p

With the last week and a half of excitement the prospect of a WotC sponsored store is more viable , the question is how they are going to do this, if it were only a digital store than it's an easy answer, but what about physical products?

Warder

There are a few ways one could go about this...

1. Custom built web based solution.
Pros: Full control of the revenue, the ability to expand directly into subscriptions and web based apps
Cons: Deep commitment to hardware, E-Commerce expenses, and customer service costs

2. Third Party Platform (DrivethruRPG for example)
Pros: No need to spend a lot of money on software engineers, no direct maintainance costs so when they want to shut it down they can do so at the end of the contract, no additional customer service.
Cons: Have to pay someone else out of the revenues, run the risk of losing a customer to a competing product on the site

Odds are good they'll go with option 2, there's really no reason to build their own site and historically their software products have been iffy at best (MTGO). Plus, the ability to let a contract end and not have ongoing expenses for years is attractive to a company.

As far as printing goes, that's easy, there's a couple of ways.

1. WOTC can try to predict demand for physical product and produce only as much as they think will be needed for the next quarter, but this is costly given the potential number of products.
2. WOTC can state that there will be a lag time between order and fullfillment and have their printers print only what was ordered each month.
3. WOTC can just contract with a print-on-demand service negotiating a lower cost to customers due to the expected high volume.

Again, WOTC will go with #3 if they do what I'm thinking they'll do. Predicting inventory has always been the bane of businesses everywhere, doing a monthly order and asking customers to wait is more expensive for WOTC and a lot of people aren't fond of waiting. Option 3 gives them the ability to offer the opportunity for physical product while minimizing expenses (Read passing them off to the customer).

The real trick here is FLGS. They need to invest them in it. To do so, they'll use their affiliate program, normal affiliates will be able to order the product at a discount so that they can undercut the WOTC store's price. Premiere stores will receive an even better discount. This will let the FLGS remain the primary source of material, let the FLGS make the decision on which material to put on the shelves based on local and global sales feedback (Something they don't have today, a way to see "What's hot and what's not"), and still let the people out in the boonies with no FLGS get material.

The only question is, did WOTC recognize the opportunity they had here?
 


Subscription models are awesome for this sort of thing, especially if they have a discount attached. I know that's a major reason why I have a lot of Paizo products, despite it being a system I don't particularly enjoy.

It is also worth noting that Paizo also make it harder to unsubscribe than to subscribe.

Cheers!

Why do you buy Paizo products if you don't like that sort of thing? Surely the discount is more than offset by buying products that you don't really enjoy.

Paizo is not along in making it harder to unsubscribe than subscribe.

TANGENT ALERT!

Norton (the antivirus people) are the worst for this. When I re-subscribed several years ago they used my credit card information to set up a yearly auto-charge "for my benefit". This auto-recharge was an opt-out thing (as in if you didn't explicitly choose to opt-out of it, you were automatically included).

I got rid of Nortons once my year of service was up, but didn't realise there was still an auto-charge on my credit card. I must have missed spotting the charge on my credit card statement the first time around, but I definitely spotted it the second year. By that time I had uninstalled the software from my computer for almost 2 years, yet the charge was still being made. It took multiple phone calls to get them to refund the second charge (and they outright refused to refund the first charge).
 

I think this kills any possibility of a full (or likely any) OGL.
So an adventure based approach (like, say, the world's biggest current RPG) kills the possibility of an OGL (like what, say, the world's biggest current RPG is based on)? I don't get that thought at all. The rules become, if not a loss leader, but an adjunct to the adventures. SO being adventure based (i.e. that is where the money comes from) seems to make it better to have an OGL. Cheap/free rules for awesome adventures.
Subscription models are awesome for this sort of thing, especially if they have a discount attached. I know that's a major reason why I have a lot of Paizo products, despite it being a system I don't particularly enjoy.

It is also worth noting that Paizo also make it harder to unsubscribe than to subscribe.

Cheers!
I don't think that posting a single post in Paizo's customer support form saying please cancel sub XYZ is any harder than clicking 'add sub to cart'. Different methods, sure, but harder? No way.
 

MerricB

Eternal Optimist
Supporter
So an adventure based approach (like, say, the world's biggest current RPG) kills the possibility of an OGL (like what, say, the world's biggest current RPG is based on)? I don't get that thought at all. The rules become, if not a loss leader, but an adjunct to the adventures. SO being adventure based (i.e. that is where the money comes from) seems to make it better to have an OGL. Cheap/free rules for awesome adventures.
I don't think that posting a single post in Paizo's customer support form saying please cancel sub XYZ is any harder than clicking 'add sub to cart'. Different methods, sure, but harder? No way.

It does not preserve anonymity. This is a big, big deal.
 

Never even thought of that, tho it is no way is any sort of deal to me. I have had and cancelled subs half a dozen or so times as circumstance changed. But I suppose some people would feel bad about posting it.
 

MerricB

Eternal Optimist
Supporter
Why do you buy Paizo products if you don't like that sort of thing? Surely the discount is more than offset by buying products that you don't really enjoy.

Nah. I don't enjoy running Pathfinder that much (although I completed two whole APs in a year), but I may change my mind about the system at some point. At the moment, I'm mainly interested in running AD&D and 5E, but in 2000 I was entirely sick of AD&D and wanted 3E. These things run in cycles, and I would much rather have the products than catch up.

There's also a lot about PF that isn't the system. So those things are always interesting.
 

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