...the REST of our gaming groups

[der_kluge]

My collection is huge, but about half of that now comes from the complimentary copies that I get from the publisher or distributor for me to review. I'm also one of the two folks in my usual circle who makes an effort to keep up with the goings-on in gaming; as with others, most of my crew doesn't care and doesn't want to either.

See, I think this is the general problem with the hobby. And it's only a problem if you're trying to sell D20 products. It's perfectly designed, which is why it will ultimately fail, and M:TG will thrive. To play D&D - all I need is one $30 book. To play M:TG I need to continuously spend money voraciously to keep up.

I can certainly respect, and understand the desire for a gamer to be in bliss with his book and be done with it. Like any hobby, you can merely take a passive interest, or you can absorb yourself in it. I like Jazz music. I own a whopping total of about 3 Jazz CDs. And I'm perfectly happy with that relationship towards Jazz music. D&D is similar - most gamers can be perfectly happy with D&D just getting a little bit of it every so often, and there is very little investment into it. So, the challenge becomes, how do you make casual Jazz listeners into Jazz enthusiasts?

 

[Henry]

I am fortunate concerning my current group. Out of six regular gamers, approximately four own most WotC products released over the past two years period. Some of them actually own more products than ME! I am the only one who reads most fan sites on an active basis, however there are two others who read ENWorld on at least a weekly basis.

The problem of "what makes a thing popular?" is age-old. The fact is, not that many players are also DM's - and THIS is the problem that Game publishers must conquer. Generally speaking, only DM's are crazy about Role-play specific gaming products. "Crunchy" products sell better, quite frankly, because players generally care more about rules that can help their character than RP.

 

[Vaxalon]

You expose them to GREAT Jazz, rather than just GOOD jazz. you take them to a really good jazz club where one of the masters is playing live.

For your own game, you have to show them how great the game can be. That means putting out your best effort, every time, and learning as much as you can about being a good DM.

 

[Samothdm]

I think die_kluge makes a good point - how do you turn a casual fan into an enthusiast?

I game in two groups - one that I DM and the other where I'm a player.

In both groups, I've noticed a general lack of interest on the part of players to buy/read other D&D books beyond just the Players Handbook.

It's extremely frustrating for the group for which I DM. I've spent the past 12+ years creating a pretty detailed world and I update our game-related website every week. Only one or two of my players ever read it.

I mention new feats, new spells, new PrCs to them and their eyes glaze over. Many of them don't even understand what a PrC is, even after I've showed them the classes in the DMG and splatbooks and explained how they can qualify.

I bought a Player's Handbook and DotF for my cleric player for his birthday and he's never read them. But, he dutifully shows up every other week for our session. I just don't get it.

I've tried to give XP awards for people who read the website updates. Didn't work. They didn't seem to care.

I guess I'm just ranting now. But, I understand the frustration that occurs when you want to talk about aspects of the game (such as the "business" side of D&D that we can read about on these forums) and your fellow "gamers" are not interested.

 

[Leopold]

i got all the books..they got most of the splat and core books. Nothing outside of WOTC does my players buy..

 

[evildm]

As I see it, it isn't so much as a lack of interest on everyone's part (though that's a factor), but that most books cost quite a bit of money. Especially with WotC releasing all these nifty 300+ page hardcover extravaganzas that cost a pretty penny, it's hard to buy everything under the sun (as I've been known to do from time to time).

Also, from my experience, if a d20 product isn't vastly different from the norm in any way, most people I know won't bother even looking at it. Even so much as just another fantasy setting will get passed over because we've already got a bunch of fantasy settings. But if it's a nifty looking sci-fi setting or what have you, then maybe it'll be bought.

Finally, another poster above mentioned that his group just doesn't care and doesn't buy many books anyway. This is particularly true with my group. Save for just a couple of the players, I'm pretty much the only one buying most of the books I can get. The way they see it, is that I'll have the book, so they won't need to pick up a copy, they'll just peruse mine.

I think that about covers it for now.

 

[HellHound]

In my groups, several are very savvy to the industry. Only in the past year have I out-savvied one of them actually. Many of us are collectors, and some of us collect HEAVILY. (I have just under 150 different RPGs, Darcy has about 100, most of the other gamers have at least 10 or so, plus significant piles of supplements).

But I understand that this is not the norm for gaming groups, and that we are just freaks.

 

[Buttercup]

I have scads of d20 stuff--well over 100 volumes. But Of the four current players in my group, two of them have the PH, one also has Oriental Adventures, one has a PH that I lent to her, and my husband has to use the other one we own. I plan on getting another PH so my husband can have his own copy, and my friend can just keep the other one.

As far as I know, none of them read this board, although I've mentioned it to them before. Heh. If one of you is lurking here, speak up! I'm sure you've figured out who I am.

 

[Magestrike]

My opinion

I personally think, from actual experience, that most "casual" gamers dont shop in gaming shops. I would say that the majority of those gamers' only exposure to gaming products is at their local bookstores. If a company doesnt have its products in a bookstore chain, then most gamers arent going to know who they are. I manage a bookstore and I see this every day.

Whenever a new product comes out from WotC, White Wolf, or SSS and its "underlings", we automatically get at least 2 copies of it in the store. Those are the only companies that this happens with. Now, my store does carry other companies products, because I specially order them. However, unless an employee in the rest of the chain does the same thing I do, or a customer requests it, most people who shop there will never see it.

I believe that to answer the question of how to turn a "casual" gamer into something more is exposure. I talk to people every day at the store about the different publishers, and most seem interested in what I have to say. The overwhelming comment I get is "Wow, I had no idea there was other publishers. Thanks."

ENWorld is a great cross section of the gaming populace, but that is just what it is. A cross section. The internet is a big place, but not all gamers are online. If most of the advertising happens online, then that severely limits the exposure a product has.

So, I guess what I am saying is, the way to lure more potential customers into the "hobby" is more exposure. People cant buy what they dont know about.

Just my 2 cents though.

Mage

 

[Churchill]

Huh...

The responses in this thread surprise me. I'd never really given the matter much thought, and I always figured the group I game with was pretty typical.

In our group (of 10-12 people) everyone has the PHB; 90% have the DMG; 80% have the MM; everyone has at least one of the splatbooks (most have at least half of them); 70% have the PsiHB; at least two of the people there have everything WotC has released for 3e; and most of us have at least one book from other publishers. A coupe of the guys are in a "competition" to see who can get each new release first.

We're also myopics unanimous (which is to say that everyone who shows up regularly wears glasses, but I digress).

Looks like we're odder than I thought.