The Revision Right Under our Noses...

[A'koss]

What I think I find the most interesting about Disintegrate (and the other revised "Save or Dies") is that the only people who can take one and survive are the ones who will never have to...

If you think about it, are you going to bother casting Disintegrate on a Dragon, a raging dwarf barbarian or similar high HP, high Con target? Can you say "Massive Fort Saves"? - I knew you could... You might as well just toss that 3rd level fireball.

So what will happen is that the only targets who are going to regularly eat the most damaging spells in the game are the ones who are least capable of handling them - Wizards, Sorcerers, Bards and the occasional Rogues. All low Hit Points and weak Fort Saves...

Just something to think about.


Cheers,

A'koss.

 

[Kai Lord]

So what will happen is that the only targets who are going to regularly eat the most damaging spells in the game are the ones who are least capable of handling them - Wizards, Sorcerers, Bards and the occasional Rogues. All low Hit Points and weak Fort Saves...

Eh, I don't mind there being a rock/paper/scissors effect with spells. To a wizard with low hit points, a fireball can be just as much an overkill as disintegrate, which would be wasted against a Rogue with Improved Evasion. Likewise, to those tough barbarians who laugh at Fort save spells, Enchantments can be murder.

 

[A'koss]

Originally posted by Kai Lord:

Eh, I don't mind there being a rock/paper/scissors effect with spells. To a wizard with low hit points, a fireball can be just as much an overkill as disintegrate, which would be wasted against a Rogue with Improved Evasion.

All I'm saying is that I find it funny that they'd design a game where the biggest damaging spells are only really useful against the Low HP/Low Fort crowd. And as you point out, it's only the low damaging stuff (that require reflex or will saves) and enchantment spells that are effective against the big HPers.

You'd think that it would the other way around...


Cheers,

A'koss.

 

[Corinth]

Once again, I point out this trick for dealing with large dice pools: spread the work around. Split that 40d6 damage roll amongst all of the players at the table; for the average group, each would roll 8d6 and then the GM would add up the subtotals. This approach keeps everyone involved in the game, keeps the game moving and avoids issues of bias.

 

[Kai Lord]

All I'm saying is that I find it funny that they'd design a game where the biggest damaging spells are only really useful against the Low HP/Low Fort crowd. And as you point out, it's only the low damaging stuff (that require reflex or will saves) and enchantment spells that are effective against the big HPers.

You'd think that it would the other way around...

The other way around? You mean you'd expect a high damage spell to be more effective against Conan the Barbarian than Willow Ufgood?

 

[A'koss]

Originally posted by Kai Lord:

The other way around? You mean you'd expect a high damage spell to be more effective against Conan the Barbarian than Willow Ufgood?

Well, game balance-wise you'd think it should be harder for a high HPer to save against it than a wizard who's definitely not going to survive it... On that note, I would've like to have seen the game geared more towards wizard-types having good saves against all magic.


Cheers,

A'koss.

 

[bloodymage]

If D changes like this, how does one now slay a tarrasque?

 

[Sir Draconion]

well to relieve some tension
in dungeon 100
finger of death is fail save die or 3d6+ 1/ lvl
so some spells don't change and
wail of the banshee save or die

 

[hong]

If D changes like this, how does one now slay a tarrasque?

Disintegrate doesn't work on the tarrasque anyway, because its reflective carapace makes ray spells useless.

 

[hong]

It will be less fun if there ends up being a bunch of different names for the same roll-a-bunch-of-dice spells.

From that point of view, lightning bolt and fireball are different names for roll-dice spells. OA adds earthbolt, and Savage Species adds sound lance. The effect remains basically the same: roll 10d6 points of damage, save for half. And really, how is this different to 3E FoD, disintegrate, destruction and slay living being different names for instakill spells?