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The "Torment a Historian" movie playlist thread


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Orius

Adventurer
Yes, well, given the irony of claiming historical accuracy when the titular character did not exist in history, it seems to me that any disappointment is purely the viewer's fault.

Yes, I am aware that anything Arthurian blurs the line between history and myth. That's why say, Excalibur did not make the cut, it's too loaded down with magic and such to count on this list even though the knights are schlepping around in full armor nearly a millenium before it existed. However, given King Arthur's grandiose claims about being as historical as possible, it deserves a place on this list.
 

Joker

First Post
Yes, well, given the irony of claiming historical accuracy when the titular character did not exist in history, it seems to me that any disappointment is purely the viewer's fault.

Not entirely the viewers fault. The tagline is "The true story behind the legend" and "The producers of the film claim to present a historically accurate version of the Arthurian legends, supposedly inspired by new archaeological findings."

So the makers create a character and claim that he is the man the legend is based on and this film is a true retelling of his life and a realistic portrayal of the legend.

This and stating that historians now agree that Arthur was a real person means that you can't blame the viewer for not being skeptical enough.

P.S. Dragonwriter, I don't write serious ;).
 



Piratecat

Writing Fantasy Gumshoe!
True, but there's a difference with taking a few liberties for dramatic purposes and showing the Macedonian cavalry riding velociraptors while trying to outflank the Persian Droid Army during the Battle of the Granicus and saying 'I swear to God, true story'.
I'd see this movie. Oh, yes.
 




Croesus

Adventurer
Spartacus (Kirk Douglas) is nothing like what little we know of that time (see The Spartacus War by Barry Strauss).

Zulu (Michael Caine) has almost no connection with the actual battle. They even wrote their own lyrics to Men of Harlech (the song they sing when the Zulu's are bashing their spears against their shields). See Like Wolves on the Fold by Mike Snook.

And don't even get me started on the old WW2 movie "Battle of the Bulge" with Henry Fonda and Robert Ryan. :p At least the first two were good movies, if bad history. Battle of the Bulge was dreck in both senses.

I hate to say it, but it seems that the best historical stuff is on TV. They don't get everything right, but they tend to do a lot better than the movies.
 

Croesus

Adventurer
Men of Harlech
(movie Zulu version)

Men of Harlech stop your dreaming
Can't you see their spear points gleaming
See their warrior pennants streaming
To this battlefield
Men of Harlech stand ye steady
It cannot be ever said ye
For the battle were not ready
Welshmen never yield
From the hills rebounding
Let this song be sounding
Summon all at Cambria's call
The mighty force surrounding
Men of Harlech on to glory
This will ever be your story
Keep these burning words before ye
Welshmen will not yield

(not historically accurate, but a great version)
 


Ahzad

Explorer
Higgins boats in Robin Hood? Seriously Ridley Scott, higgins boats?

didn't see the movie b/c of that alone, it made my brain hurt to much.
 

Viking Bastard

Adventurer
I love A Knight's Tale. It's clearly not meant to be taken as historically accurate. Crass historical inaccuracy only bugs me when movies sell themselves as being accurate.
 

Joker

First Post
True, but there's a difference with taking a few liberties for dramatic purposes and showing the Macedonian cavalry riding velociraptors while trying to outflank the Persian Droid Army during the Battle of the Granicus and saying 'I swear to God, true story'.

In the Battle of the Granicus they had to cross a river. So...Higgens boats.
 

Dragonwriter

First Post
Okay, I've got one to add now.

Robin Hood: Prince of Thieves (and others, I'm sure) - Robin doesn't speak with a British accent. And it's rather glaringly obvious. I find it hard to believe I didn't think of this before.

And numerous other movies (not just Robin Hood ones) are guilty of this, First Knight among them.

P.S. Dragonwriter, I don't write serious ;).

Just checking. :)
 

Consider how much speech patterns have changed in America in the past 70 years (listen to the accents of Humphrey Bogart, or Franklin Roosevelt). Who's to say that a certain portion of the British Isles had accents back in Robin Hood's day that sound very similar to modern American?

In fact, I ran a d20 modern game where one PC was a displaced knight from King Arthur's court, and he insisted that everyone there sounded like they were from modern Florida. (And that Camelot was regularly beset by vampires.)
 

Dragonwriter

First Post
Consider how much speech patterns have changed in America in the past 70 years (listen to the accents of Humphrey Bogart, or Franklin Roosevelt). Who's to say that a certain portion of the British Isles had accents back in Robin Hood's day that sound very similar to modern American?

While possible, how does his own father have a thoroughly British accent, while Robin doesn't?

I get the point you are making, but this is a semi-humorous thread concerning "historical" movies and their mistakes. This particular bit was such a big deal, it even got a mention in Robin Hood: Men In Tights! :lol:
 

Relique du Madde

First Post
Easily. Robin hood lost his accent when he fought in the crusades as a result of Saladin's men taking it from Robin during his captivity.

This data transmission was sent via cybernetic implant.
 

I switched off my DVD of Timeline when the "English" nobles (speaking with posh English accents) took a modern Frenchman prisoner, while completely ignoring the Scotsman in the party. Or something like that, it's been a while since I attempted to watch it.
 

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