Time of Vengeance [closed]
- Thread starter hero4hire
- Start date
Jemal
Adventurer
Upon looking back, I believe that may be Thanee's character under discussion... whoops. Ah well, it makes no difference, it wasn't the character but rather the reasoning I was debating.
And just for the record, in case it got lost, my last post was supposed to be rather Tongue-in-cheek.
And no, I've never actualy struck a friend, and I can't ACTUALLY think of how badly they'd have to tick me off before I could.. I'm exceedingly loyal and trusting of my friends, and we've had a few pretty bad arguments.. I even had a friend offer to LET me hit him once, cuz he knew how badly he'd pissed me off. But I never actually would. Just wanted to clear that up before some of you got the wrong idea 'bout me.
And just for the record, in case it got lost, my last post was supposed to be rather Tongue-in-cheek.
And no, I've never actualy struck a friend, and I can't ACTUALLY think of how badly they'd have to tick me off before I could.. I'm exceedingly loyal and trusting of my friends, and we've had a few pretty bad arguments.. I even had a friend offer to LET me hit him once, cuz he knew how badly he'd pissed me off. But I never actually would. Just wanted to clear that up before some of you got the wrong idea 'bout me.
Thanee
First Post
hero4hire said:So...What do we do know H4H?
Well we have some options.
I can let you have a go at it again (and again and again if need be) until we get something we are both happy with.
I can see what I can do on my end to make the concept work.
We can scrap the idea and have you make something else.
You can tell me I am too tight-gripped in my character generation and tell me to go F*** myself.
I would never say such mean things.
Well, judging from the points you addressed, I see only minor issues (a couple points here and there), nothing that would require a complete rebuilt, so I don't see why we shouldn't get this to a level you and I are both happy with.
Congratulations!
Bye
Thanee
hero4hire
Explorer
I was halfway through typing up a point by point response but I scrapped it.
I don't really want to debate about design philosophy or what is or os not point crunching. Everyone has different opinions. And they are opinions not right or wrong.
Perhaps I am old and set in my ways, but I like characters that are built similiar to the published material. Not exact builds mind you! Or even similiar concepts but *how* they are built. I looked over my M&M books. I found one superpowered character (a paraplegic) who had a +0 base attack. He was a PL 5 or 6.
For PL 10 characters the lowest I found was for an Illusionist who has a +3 base attack.
About 90% (or more) o fthe builds I found actually maxed out thier base attack.
Likewise I didn't find a lot of (any) uber-efficient builds (or what I call point crunching)
Basically that is what I like to see in my game for builds, at least philosophy wise.
As for my presentation being offensive, I apologize if it was construde that way. That was not the intent.
Basically what I was saying is that if we were friends around a table I would just say "no"
to something I didnt want in my game and in a way that I am comfortable doing with my friends. Its not like I lurk around grassy knolls, crumpling up paper and throwing it strangers or anything (anymore anyway!) I had stated some things that I would've liked "fixed" for Fusion (including that lil old Pet-Peeve of mine). Some were, some were not, others were found, and that was me in a "tongue and cheek" way saying "no'".
I do appreciate everyone working with me or at the very least trying to,
and I really dont like being a pain in the @$$.
I have stated what points I dont like (and the reasoning) and what I wont allow so I won't be belaboring or debating them further.
I look forward to reaching a build both Thevshi and I will be happy with.
I don't really want to debate about design philosophy or what is or os not point crunching. Everyone has different opinions. And they are opinions not right or wrong.
Perhaps I am old and set in my ways, but I like characters that are built similiar to the published material. Not exact builds mind you! Or even similiar concepts but *how* they are built. I looked over my M&M books. I found one superpowered character (a paraplegic) who had a +0 base attack. He was a PL 5 or 6.
For PL 10 characters the lowest I found was for an Illusionist who has a +3 base attack.
About 90% (or more) o fthe builds I found actually maxed out thier base attack.
Likewise I didn't find a lot of (any) uber-efficient builds (or what I call point crunching)
Basically that is what I like to see in my game for builds, at least philosophy wise.
As for my presentation being offensive, I apologize if it was construde that way. That was not the intent.
Basically what I was saying is that if we were friends around a table I would just say "no"
to something I didnt want in my game and in a way that I am comfortable doing with my friends. Its not like I lurk around grassy knolls, crumpling up paper and throwing it strangers or anything (anymore anyway!) I had stated some things that I would've liked "fixed" for Fusion (including that lil old Pet-Peeve of mine). Some were, some were not, others were found, and that was me in a "tongue and cheek" way saying "no'".
I do appreciate everyone working with me or at the very least trying to,
and I really dont like being a pain in the @$$.
I have stated what points I dont like (and the reasoning) and what I wont allow so I won't be belaboring or debating them further.
I look forward to reaching a build both Thevshi and I will be happy with.
hero4hire
Explorer
Thanee said:I would never say such mean things.
Well, judging from the points you addressed, I see only minor issues (a couple points here and there), nothing that would require a complete rebuilt
A hunk of points I noticed you can save is from Wealth. I don't use the wealth system so one rank of Benefit (Rich) is sufficient.
Mechanics I think is represented by Craft (Mechanical), but I would allow certain things to be covered by Profession (Race Car Driver) including minor work on automobiles if you think Craft would be to broad of a skill for her. Profession would also include when to Pit Stop, procedure in a pit stop, what rules for different races, possibly how different racetracks differ etc..
Thanee
First Post
[SBLOCK=old text]Updated the sheet with some more points addressed, like the Profession skill added back in and some skill ratings shuffled around, Luck lowered to 2, and Attack Focus swapped out for Attack Bonus (apparantly, Fiona has been to the shooting range regularily after all, now all she needs is a ranged attack 
).
Left 2 points unspent for now... would it be ok to save them in order to be able to create new Alternate Forms eventually (only with the proper motivation and if you ok them then, of course)?[/SBLOCK]
Fusion
[SBLOCK=Fusion]Power Level 10
Power Points 146/150
Defense/Toughness Tradeoff -5/+5
Attack/Damage Tradeoff ±0/±0
Experience 0
Hero Points 3
Abilities:
Str 10 (+0) [Car 18 (+4) / S-Str 4, Exo 18 (+4) / S-Str 1]
Dex 18 (+4)
Con 14 (+2) [Car 18 (+4), Exo 18 (+4)]
Int 18 (+4)
Wis 14 (+2)
Cha 18 (+4)
Power Points: 32
Combat:
Initiative +8
Attack +5 [Car +4, Exo melee +10, ranged +4, PA melee +10]
Defense +5 (flat-footed +3)
Damage (unarmed) +0 [Car (unarmed) +4, Exo (unarmed) +4, (Strike) +10, PA (Strike) +5]
Power Points: 20
Saves:
Toughness Save +2 [Car +15, Exo +15, PA +15]
Fortitude Save +6 [Car +8, Exo +8]
Reflex Save +10
Will Save +12
Power Points: 20
Skills:
Acrobatics +10(6)
Bluff +10(6)
Climb +6(6)
Computers +10(6)
Concentration +10(8)
Diplomacy +10(6)
Drive +15(11)
Gather Information +10(6)
Investigate +8(4)
Knowledge (Business) +5(1)
Knowledge (Current Events) +5(1)
Knowledge (Popular Culture) +5(1)
Knowledge (Streetwise) +5(1)
Knowledge (Technology) +10(6)
Notice +12(10)
Profession (Race Driver) +10(8)
Search +10(6)
Sense Motive +10(8)
Stealth +10(6) [Car +6, Exo +6]
Swim +5(5)
Power Points: 28
Feats:
Accurate Attack
All-Out Attack
Attractive 2
Benefit (Status) 1
Benefit (Rich) 1
Connected
Contacts
Defensive Attack
Distract (Bluff)
Improved Initiative 1
Luck 2
Move-By Action
Power Attack
Quick Change 2
Skill Mastery (Acrobatics, Bluff, Concentration, Drive)
Well-Informed
Power Points: 29
Powers:
Array of Alternate Form 25
» Flaw : Unreliable
» Feat : Alternate Power 2
Alternate Form 10
» Car Form [50PP]
» Fast Overrun
» Improved Overrun
» Improved Trip
» Morph 1
» » Extra: Duration (continuous)
» » Flaw : Permanent
» » Feat : Innate
» Growth 4 (large size)
» » Extra: Duration (continuous)
» » Extra: Linked to Morph
» » Flaw : Permanent
» » Feat : Innate
» Protection 11
» » Extra: Linked to Morph
» » Feat : Innate
» Immovable 3
» » Extra: Unstoppable
» » Extra: Linked to Morph
» » Feat : Innate
» Super-Strength 4
» » Extra: Linked to Morph
» » Feat : Innate
» » Drawback: Temporary Disability 4 (no fine manipulation)
» Enhanced Defense 1
» » Extra: Linked to Morph
» Speed 6
[SBLOCK=Car Image]
[/SBLOCK]
» Exoskeleton Form [50PP]
» Attack Focus (melee) 6
» Improved Critical (Strike) 2
» Takedown Attack 2
» Morph 1
» » Extra: Duration (continuous)
» » Flaw : Permanent
» » Feat : Innate
» Growth 4 (large size)
» » Extra: Duration (continuous)
» » Extra: Linked to Morph
» » Flaw : Permanent
» » Feat : Innate
» Protection 11
» » Extra: Linked to Morph
» » Feat : Innate
» Super-Strength 1
» » Extra: Linked to Morph
» » Feat : Innate
» Enhanced Defense 1
» » Extra: Linked to Morph
» Strike 6
» » Feat : Mighty 1
» » Drawback: Full Power
» Speed 2
[SBLOCK=Exoskeleton Image]
[/SBLOCK]
Alternate Form 5
» Extra: Duration (continuous)
» Personal Armor Form [25PP]
» Attack Focus (melee) 5
» Improved Critical (Strike) 2
» Protection 13
» Strike 5
Power Points: 27
Drawbacks:
???
Power Points: +0
Complications:
Fame
Responsibility
Description:
Fiona Stark is an attractive woman in her mid twenties. She is 5'8" tall and weighs 120 lbs with a well-toned figure. Fiona has shoulder-long blonde hair and green eyes.
Background:
Fiona Stark, former race driver, daughter of industrial magnate Edward Stark, who also happens to be the owner of Stark Automobiles and the Stark Racing Team. Fiona is not only rich and beautiful, she also happens to be one of the best drivers in the world. Quite naturally, she had been attracted to fast cars since she was old enough to drive, and thanks to her father, she soon became a race driver in his own team with great success. Until one day, when she had that accident. Fiona was test driving a new sports car with a brand new fusion-powered engine (the first of its kind), when she lost control of the insanely fast and powerful racing car. It was one of the most disastrous accidents in the history of the motorsport, and one of the strangest as well. The car burst into iridescent flames and was entirely consumed by the blazing fire. There was no trace left of it, when the helpers arrived. Nothing at all. Just the burn marks on the asphalt... and her. Fiona must have been catapulted outside, at least that's the only explanation, noone saw exactly what happened, because apart from a few bruises and scratches she was mostly unharmed, even though unconscious. What truely happend cannot really be explained, anyways. In truth, Fiona was inside the car still, when it went afire, and throughout the whole process; a process, which changed her in a fundamental way. She became one with her car, merged with it, assimilated it; it's hard to explain what exactly happened that day.
This was one year ago. Fiona had recovered in a hospital. The low amount of radiation detected around her was explained with the explosion of the small fusion reactor and considered harmless. A month after the accident, Fiona left the hospital and went back home. She ended her career as a race driver the day after. Fiona had found something else to pursue and explore... herself. Her new self. Being merged with a car and having absolute control over its matter certainly takes some time getting used to. Being able to change into the car, but being unable to leave it, because you are part of it, or rather, being able to create the car around you, extract it from your back or spine or wherever it's coming from, is also somewhat unusual to say the least. And once you realize, that it's not just the car, but just about anything you could create with the material, you need a strong will to not go insane. Luckily, Fiona never had a problem with that...[/SBLOCK]
Bye
Thanee
).Left 2 points unspent for now... would it be ok to save them in order to be able to create new Alternate Forms eventually (only with the proper motivation and if you ok them then, of course)?[/SBLOCK]
Fusion
[SBLOCK=Fusion]Power Level 10
Power Points 146/150
Defense/Toughness Tradeoff -5/+5
Attack/Damage Tradeoff ±0/±0
Experience 0
Hero Points 3
Abilities:
Str 10 (+0) [Car 18 (+4) / S-Str 4, Exo 18 (+4) / S-Str 1]
Dex 18 (+4)
Con 14 (+2) [Car 18 (+4), Exo 18 (+4)]
Int 18 (+4)
Wis 14 (+2)
Cha 18 (+4)
Power Points: 32
Combat:
Initiative +8
Attack +5 [Car +4, Exo melee +10, ranged +4, PA melee +10]
Defense +5 (flat-footed +3)
Damage (unarmed) +0 [Car (unarmed) +4, Exo (unarmed) +4, (Strike) +10, PA (Strike) +5]
Power Points: 20
Saves:
Toughness Save +2 [Car +15, Exo +15, PA +15]
Fortitude Save +6 [Car +8, Exo +8]
Reflex Save +10
Will Save +12
Power Points: 20
Skills:
Acrobatics +10(6)
Bluff +10(6)
Climb +6(6)
Computers +10(6)
Concentration +10(8)
Diplomacy +10(6)
Drive +15(11)
Gather Information +10(6)
Investigate +8(4)
Knowledge (Business) +5(1)
Knowledge (Current Events) +5(1)
Knowledge (Popular Culture) +5(1)
Knowledge (Streetwise) +5(1)
Knowledge (Technology) +10(6)
Notice +12(10)
Profession (Race Driver) +10(8)
Search +10(6)
Sense Motive +10(8)
Stealth +10(6) [Car +6, Exo +6]
Swim +5(5)
Power Points: 28
Feats:
Accurate Attack
All-Out Attack
Attractive 2
Benefit (Status) 1
Benefit (Rich) 1
Connected
Contacts
Defensive Attack
Distract (Bluff)
Improved Initiative 1
Luck 2
Move-By Action
Power Attack
Quick Change 2
Skill Mastery (Acrobatics, Bluff, Concentration, Drive)
Well-Informed
Power Points: 29
Powers:
Array of Alternate Form 25
» Flaw : Unreliable
» Feat : Alternate Power 2
Alternate Form 10
» Car Form [50PP]
» Fast Overrun
» Improved Overrun
» Improved Trip
» Morph 1
» » Extra: Duration (continuous)
» » Flaw : Permanent
» » Feat : Innate
» Growth 4 (large size)
» » Extra: Duration (continuous)
» » Extra: Linked to Morph
» » Flaw : Permanent
» » Feat : Innate
» Protection 11
» » Extra: Linked to Morph
» » Feat : Innate
» Immovable 3
» » Extra: Unstoppable
» » Extra: Linked to Morph
» » Feat : Innate
» Super-Strength 4
» » Extra: Linked to Morph
» » Feat : Innate
» » Drawback: Temporary Disability 4 (no fine manipulation)
» Enhanced Defense 1
» » Extra: Linked to Morph
» Speed 6
[SBLOCK=Car Image]
» Exoskeleton Form [50PP]
» Attack Focus (melee) 6
» Improved Critical (Strike) 2
» Takedown Attack 2
» Morph 1
» » Extra: Duration (continuous)
» » Flaw : Permanent
» » Feat : Innate
» Growth 4 (large size)
» » Extra: Duration (continuous)
» » Extra: Linked to Morph
» » Flaw : Permanent
» » Feat : Innate
» Protection 11
» » Extra: Linked to Morph
» » Feat : Innate
» Super-Strength 1
» » Extra: Linked to Morph
» » Feat : Innate
» Enhanced Defense 1
» » Extra: Linked to Morph
» Strike 6
» » Feat : Mighty 1
» » Drawback: Full Power
» Speed 2
[SBLOCK=Exoskeleton Image]
Alternate Form 5
» Extra: Duration (continuous)
» Personal Armor Form [25PP]
» Attack Focus (melee) 5
» Improved Critical (Strike) 2
» Protection 13
» Strike 5
Power Points: 27
Drawbacks:
???
Power Points: +0
Complications:
Fame
Responsibility
Description:
Fiona Stark is an attractive woman in her mid twenties. She is 5'8" tall and weighs 120 lbs with a well-toned figure. Fiona has shoulder-long blonde hair and green eyes.
Background:
Fiona Stark, former race driver, daughter of industrial magnate Edward Stark, who also happens to be the owner of Stark Automobiles and the Stark Racing Team. Fiona is not only rich and beautiful, she also happens to be one of the best drivers in the world. Quite naturally, she had been attracted to fast cars since she was old enough to drive, and thanks to her father, she soon became a race driver in his own team with great success. Until one day, when she had that accident. Fiona was test driving a new sports car with a brand new fusion-powered engine (the first of its kind), when she lost control of the insanely fast and powerful racing car. It was one of the most disastrous accidents in the history of the motorsport, and one of the strangest as well. The car burst into iridescent flames and was entirely consumed by the blazing fire. There was no trace left of it, when the helpers arrived. Nothing at all. Just the burn marks on the asphalt... and her. Fiona must have been catapulted outside, at least that's the only explanation, noone saw exactly what happened, because apart from a few bruises and scratches she was mostly unharmed, even though unconscious. What truely happend cannot really be explained, anyways. In truth, Fiona was inside the car still, when it went afire, and throughout the whole process; a process, which changed her in a fundamental way. She became one with her car, merged with it, assimilated it; it's hard to explain what exactly happened that day.
This was one year ago. Fiona had recovered in a hospital. The low amount of radiation detected around her was explained with the explosion of the small fusion reactor and considered harmless. A month after the accident, Fiona left the hospital and went back home. She ended her career as a race driver the day after. Fiona had found something else to pursue and explore... herself. Her new self. Being merged with a car and having absolute control over its matter certainly takes some time getting used to. Being able to change into the car, but being unable to leave it, because you are part of it, or rather, being able to create the car around you, extract it from your back or spine or wherever it's coming from, is also somewhat unusual to say the least. And once you realize, that it's not just the car, but just about anything you could create with the material, you need a strong will to not go insane. Luckily, Fiona never had a problem with that...[/SBLOCK]
Bye
Thanee
Last edited:
hero4hire
Explorer
Thanks for the revision Thanee.
I appreciate you covering some of the issues I had.
However I am afraid I still am not going to allow the action flaw on the alternate form.
Edit: I browsed the Official Questions Forum to see if this has come up. Author Steve Kenson suggests using the Action Drawback instead of the Flaw. I find that to be pretty fair.
1 point Drawback per step. So from Free to Full would be 3pp.
I appreciate you covering some of the issues I had.
However I am afraid I still am not going to allow the action flaw on the alternate form.
Edit: I browsed the Official Questions Forum to see if this has come up. Author Steve Kenson suggests using the Action Drawback instead of the Flaw. I find that to be pretty fair.
1 point Drawback per step. So from Free to Full would be 3pp.
Last edited:
Thanee
First Post
hero4hire said:
That's kinda weird, considering it's explained at length (even has its own paragraph under Container), how the Action Flaw would be applied (which is where I got it from).
Maybe Steve has changed his mind after Ultimate Power was written/printed.
Anyways... only thing I can see right now, which would make a pretty quick change would be to require a Skill Check (Concentration or Knowledge (tech) would be appropriate ones) for the whole Array or make it Unreliable (meaning that Fiona's control over her power is yet underdeveloped and she would probably save XP to buy it off at some point in future to show her gaining experience with it). Skill is clearly the weaker Flaw, since you can get a better chance than 50% (but costs extra points). Unreliable is just fixed, so easier to adjudicate.
How about any of those?
Bye
Thanee
hero4hire
Explorer
Thanee said:That's kinda weird, considering it's explained at length (even has its own paragraph under Container), how the Action Flaw would be applied (which is where I got it from).
Maybe Steve has changed his mind after Ultimate Power was written/printed.
Anyways... only thing I can see right now, which would make a pretty quick change would be to require a Skill Check (Concentration or Knowledge (tech) would be appropriate ones) for the whole Array or make it Unreliable (meaning that Fiona's control over her power is yet underdeveloped and she would probably save XP to buy it off at some point in future to show her gaining experience with it). Skill is clearly the weaker Flaw, since you can get a better chance than 50% (but costs extra points). Unreliable is just fixed, so easier to adjudicate.
How about any of those?
Bye
Thanee
Unreliable is fine. I generally dont use "Needs Skill Check".
Similar Threads
