D&D General TPK or Imprison

[Mort]

TPK, because I have never had a player do anything other than fight to the absolute death.

The bad guys can choose to knock the players unconscious rather that kill them, as long as there is a reason to do so.

I find that if I make sure players understand fighting to the death is not required/expected or the best option then they tend to catch on quickly.

 

[Mort]

After reading responses and thinking on it, I am leaning toward imprisonment by fiat. "You barely remember what happened. The teleportation circle began to glow and your alarm spell started to scream, but then the pain in your minds took over." (Some of the enemies are psionic.) They wake up in the cells without rest or gear and maybe a level of exhaustion, but they are actually closer to their goal. Now the question becomes do they attempt to escape or attempt to finish the mission -- even if they do so, they probably won't survive.

Imprisonment by cut scene is often a tough sell - depends on your players. But it wouldn't be my first choice as it seems exactly like the ham handedness you seem to be trying to avoid.

The alternative is to actually let that fight run out, which is where I am afraid the TPK will come in because in my experience, players refuse to surrender ever, and only very rarely flee. The worst case scenario would be for half the party to be dead and half the party captured, I think. It would be really tough to plausibly inject a bunch of replacement PCs.

If the bad guys have access to melee weapons and spells that incapacitate, capture without TPK is actually pretty likely. From what you've said they are NOT expecting teleporting in enemies. Frankly I find it poetic justice to give players a taste of scry and fry (especially when, far from malicious it's 100% warranted by the parties own actions). Unless the group is warded against charm, it's not THAT hard to take them alive if the villains get the drop on them.

I do have one other option: they made friends-ish with a self interested, kind of villainous party who is established to have the power necessary to save the party at the last minute. If I want to avoid the problem altogether and take the choice out of the PCs hands, they can show up and be like "Come with me if you want to live, and then you can do that job I asked you about a few weeks ago." Among the problems with this solution is that it veers off this storyline and I am trying to wrap things up.

I like this option because it lets the players know that an asset they'd "collected" has truly come in handy. Players love it when something from their past comes back in a positive vs. negative way! As for veering off - well just make sure that the save comes with an express - now get this done and get it done pronto prompt and shouldn't be a big departure. Probably less than imprisonment actually. So a nice compromise option.

So definitely seems like the best of the options presented.

GMing is hard sometimes.

Seems fund though.

 

[jasper]

Split the difference. Kill half of them, imprison the rest. If you have an odd number cut off the legs and imprison the remainer.

 

[Oofta]

Don't sell yourself short. Some people aspire to greatness, some people's purpose in life is to be an example of what not to do! Embrace being the world's worst DM!

 

[Stalker0]

I’ve done a decent number of prison break adventures and i think they can be a lot of fun, it’s a great change of pace to strip the party of all equipment and spell components and then let them go. It’s also a great chance to try low level people at them and it still be a great challenge.

 

[Oofta]

I've only had a couple of TPKs in my history of DMing, most have just been very close calls.

However, I don't really have many qualms about people facing the consequences of their decisions. Bad luck? I'm going to be fairly lenient. Multiple bad decisions when I'm certain they should have known better or were metagaming and making assumptions? That's another story.

So if you can make the last fight epic, if you can give them a chance, however slim, to pull off something truly amazing I'd be okay with a TPK. On the other hand I would probably only imprison them if you can come up with a good reason they would be imprisoned and an interesting story arc for their escape.

The only thing I would caution is to not do a TPK just because you aren't happy with the group and/or campaign. If you are ready to restart, even with a different group, just have a conversation with their players and ask what they want to do. Maybe ya'll just say "yep we all died, see you in the next life". But I also wouldn't assume a foregone conclusion, even if there is only a small chance they'll succeed they deserve a shot at that chance.

There isn't always a best answer. Good luck.

 

[Weiley31]

Implosion.

 

[Shadowdweller00]

In most cases for most groups - imprisonment. Beat and taunt (briefly! Too much exposition = ungood) them while they're down for their stupidity. Take their stuff, let them recover their major pieces of equipment but lose a bit of the minor; force them to try escape at reduced hp.

 

[Dausuul]

I see several potential traps here:

1. Killing the whole party with overwhelming force, even if they've set themselves up for it, is a lousy way to end a campaign.
2. Beating down the party to zero, but then having the bad guys take them alive, can easily feel like a DM taking pity on the party.
3. Declaring that the PCs were captured by fiat, without a chance to react, rubs players really raw.

What I would do is have the bad guys come through the circle in force and hit the whole party with psionic stun attacks. Minions rush to bind and gag PCs who fail their saves. By leading off this way, you make it clear that their goal from the start is capture, so if somebody does end up getting beat down to zero, it won't feel like DM charity to let them live.

Now, I don't believe in combat theater--if you pick up dice, there should be a possibility of multiple outcomes. But nobody said those outcomes had to include "PCs kill all the monsters and win." PCs who make their initial saves can flee, and if they do, they should have a high chance to escape. Then they can set to work rescuing their companions. If they try to fight, they get beat down and captured with the rest, and now the party must escape without outside help.

Of course, all this does depend on you being able to think up a plausible reason for the bad guys to want the PCs alive. If not, I would instead opt for a staged attack. The teleportation circle flares up, giving the PCs one round of warning, and then the first wave of monsters comes through. Then it flares again, heralding the second wave... and the third... and so on. This gives the players time to realize that they are going to be overwhelmed and that they need to GTFO. If they insist on fighting to the death, well, so be it.

 

[Vaalingrade]

I mean ask them, but in general, I find death to be boring anyway, especially if that's it and that's where we end. Or worse, roll up a bunch of scrubs to play out the last down for some reason.