Tracking over rock. Is it too easy?

[hong]

hong, you posting examples of things that dont matter in any way, shape, or form does not prove any point for or against.

Whatever you say, d00d. Have you figured out how tracking works yet?

More trolling.

Irony, thy name is Scion.

You are spouting random drivel for no reason. Way to go hong. Why is it that you are always like that by the way?

The answer lies within yourself, grasshopper.

Contribute something useful or just go away. Trolling = bad.

Irony, thy name is STILL Scion.

 

[Scion]

You cannot contribut anything constructive at all can you?

So far you want people to cast rock to mud to reduce dc 20 to dc 5.

Or you wish to ignore any and all counter examples by spouting more insults.

Why are you even posting here? You have said nothing useful for the entire thread. Completly unhelpful.

 

[hong]

You are right, flying has nothing to do with the original thread. Nor does 'changing the ground to mud or rock'.

Oh good, you do have some capacity to see sense.

The baddy knows the terrain, he knows where he is going, he knows where not to step.. although mistakes can be made.

Because every bad guy knows every inch of every corridor in his lair. In Scionworld, psychic bad guys rule!

Also, we know that it is a 'well used' corridor.

Unless previously made marks somehow manage to obliterate newly-made marks in Scionworld, this is irrelevant.

Traveled very often.

See above.

There are many doors.

One of which probably made a sound when it was slammed shut, or has recent prints leading up to it.

So when the pc's enter they are in an area they havent seen before, there are marks everywhere from previous travel, and all of the doors show sign of fairly recent use.

Repetition does not make your case stronger.

And that is DC 20???? Somewhere in there at least one of those things has to count for 'something'.

Did anybody said it couldn't?

 

[hong]

You cannot contribut anything constructive at all can you?

I do this better than you, amateur.

So far you want people to cast rock to mud to reduce dc 20 to dc 5.

Such surrealism rivals anything created by the dadaist generator. Are you a bot, by any chance?

Or you wish to ignore any and all counter examples by spouting more insults.

That isn't quite the worst attempt I've seen to get into my sig, but it's getting close.

Why are you even posting here?

Because it's FUN!

You have said nothing useful for the entire thread. Completly unhelpful.

Completely unhelpful for you, yes.

 

[Lord Pendragon]

I fail to see how DC 20 doesn't already represent a sufficient difficulty. If we assume a dedicated tracker, we have:

* the track feat
* +4 (skill points)
* +2 (ability bonus)
* +3 (skill focus feat)

For a total of +9. Taking 10, he can't succeed the DC 20 check over stone. If he takes 20 he can succeed, but taking 20 requires so much time that the quarry will have had plenty of time to get away regardless. If he rolls, he's got a 45% chance of succeeding.

In my experience, though, most dedicated trackers still don't take Skill Focus (Survival), so it's worse than I've outlined above. For non-dedicated trackers it's even worse. If the quarry has a moment to hide his tracks, it's much worse.

I don't see a problem with the way this all works. It makes perfect sense to me, really.

 

[Scion]

Sure pendragon, but level 2 is hardly a powerhouse of skills and feats. Take away the skill focus feat, make the character level 2, they have a +12 pretty easily, they cannot fail. There is no rolling, there is no failure.

Does that sit well with you?

 

[hong]

Sure pendragon, but level 2 is hardly a powerhouse of skills and feats. Take away the skill focus feat, make the character level 2, they have a +12 pretty easily, they cannot fail. There is no rolling, there is no failure.

Does that sit well with you?

Assuming the "no rolling, no failure" bit is what's troubling you, your beef is with the binary nature of skill checks (and most other things in d20/D&D), not with the tracking DCs.

 

[Lord Pendragon]

Sure pendragon, but level 2 is hardly a powerhouse of skills and feats. Take away the skill focus feat, make the character level 2, they have a +12 pretty easily, they cannot fail. There is no rolling, there is no failure.

Does that sit well with you?

How are you getting to that +12? At level 2, without skill focus, I'm getting...

+5 ranks
+2 ability

What else are you including? A +5 skill bonus magic item? If the PC is willing to spend most of their gold on one of these at level 2, then they deserve to succeed. Especially since, if the prey has a chance to cover his tracks, he'll still fail.

Yeah, this sits well with me Scion. At level 5, mages will be flying.

 

[Scion]

How are you getting to that +12? At level 2, without skill focus, I'm getting...

+5 ranks
+2 ability

What else are you including? A +5 skill bonus magic item? If the PC is willing to spend most of their gold on one of these at level 2, then they deserve to succeed. Especially since, if the prey has a chance to cover his tracks, he'll still fail.

Yeah, this sits well with me Scion. At level 5, mages will be flying.

Not everyone can fly pendragon And i would still allow tracking checks to track flying foes, it would just be at an appropriate penalty.

+12 came from a post above
+5 ranks
+2 ability
+4 synergy (knowledge- dungeonering and search)
+1 item (shouldnt be too hard really, but it isnt necissary, just a beanie)

faling this
+5 ranks
+2 ability
+2 synergy (should be pretty easy to get at least one of the two, and search is such a useful skill after all)
+1 item
= +10 and the character still cant fail.

I like skills being useful and all, however some things should be difficult to low level people anyway. That is not to say it should be made difficult to keep up with advancing skills. But I definately think that there should be a way to show other people having skills too.

Tracking someone across a room from two days before after it has been trampled by a few hundred other people is dc 22. That seems.. odd.. to me.

From the examples above about spotting invisible people. That is incredibly difficult, it requires being very good to succeed. This is not a dm nerf, it is built in. The circumstance modifiers need to be expanded greatly for this feat.

Same with the fighter example from above, if you only have three kinds of armor in the world and nothing else matters eventually someone will think something is wrong same problem.

 

[hong]

Not everyone can fly pendragon And i would still allow tracking checks to track flying foes, it would just be at an appropriate penalty.

Who's being silly now?

+12 came from a post above
+5 ranks
+2 ability
+4 synergy (knowledge- dungeonering and search)
+1 item (shouldnt be too hard really, but it isnt necissary, just a beanie)

Someone spending 15 ranks just to get a tracking check of +11 under limited circumstances is not your average 2nd level character.

faling this
+5 ranks
+2 ability
+2 synergy (should be pretty easy to get at least one of the two, and search is such a useful skill after all)
+1 item
= +10 and the character still cant fail.

... until a +1 circumstance mod to the DC is applied. Strange things, those modifiers.

I like skills being useful and all, however some things should be difficult to low level people anyway. That is not to say it should be made difficult to keep up with advancing skills. But I definately think that there should be a way to show other people having skills too.

Can you turn that into English, please?

Tracking someone across a room from two days before after it has been trampled by a few hundred other people is dc 22. That seems.. odd.. to me.

How is this relevant to anything that's been said in this thread, exactly?

From the examples above about spotting invisible people. That is incredibly difficult, it requires being very good to succeed. This is not a dm nerf, it is built in. The circumstance modifiers need to be expanded greatly for this feat.

The DM is free to apply any damn circumstance modifier he or she thinks appropriate. If the DM wants to abuse the backdoor, they can even do that.

Same with the fighter example from above, if you only have three kinds of armor in the world and nothing else matters eventually someone will think something is wrong same problem.

You're babbling again.