Trips?

[hong]

Tripping someone doesn't provoke an AoO, whether you do it unarmed or armed.

Haw haw, Caliban said he was going to disagree to agree and now he's not! Haw haw!!!1!

Making the initial touch attack, if unarmed, should provoke an AoO, shouldn't it?

 

[Caliban]

Haw haw, Caliban said he was going to disagree to agree and now he's not! Haw haw!!!1!

Making the initial touch attack, if unarmed, should provoke an AoO, shouldn't it?

Nope. See the posts back at the beginning of this thread where it was originally discussed. I don't feel like going through it again.


(And I only agreed to disagree about using a non-trip weapon to trip. This is a seperate issue. All you guys are arguing about is if you can use Weapon Focus and the weapons enhancement bonus when you trip someone without using a "trip" weapon. I decided it's not worth the arguement)

 

[hong]

Nope. See the posts back at the beginning of this thread where it was originally discussed. I don't feel like going through it again.

The trip action itself doesn't provoke an AoO, but making an unarmed attack surely would.

(And I only agreed to disagree about using a non-trip weapon to trip. This is a seperate issue. All you guys are arguing about is if you can use Weapon Focus and the weapons enhancement bonus when you trip someone without using a "trip" weapon. I decided it's not worth the arguement)

Haw haw!!!1 Caliban wants the last word by saying that he doesn't want the last word!!11!!!

 

[Caliban]

The trip action itself doesn't provoke an AoO, but making an unarmed attack surely would.

Once again, read the posts at the beginning of this thread. This has already been covered.

 

[hong]

Once again, read the posts at the beginning of this thread. This has already been covered.

I'm not seeing it. The trip itself doesn't provoke an AoO, yes. Making an unarmed touch attack to _initiate_ the trip still counts as an unarmed attack, and that should still provoke an AoO (unless you have Improved Unarmed Strike).

 

[Caliban]

I'm not seeing it. The trip itself doesn't provoke an AoO, yes. Making an unarmed touch attack to _initiate_ the trip still counts as an unarmed attack, and that should still provoke an AoO (unless you have Improved Unarmed Strike).

Nope. Making an unarmed strike provokes an AoO. The touch attack to initiate the trip is an unarmed attack, but it is not an unarmed strike any more than the touch attack to start a grapple is.

Improved Unarmed Strike doesn't help you with trips or grapples, because they aren't "Unarmed Strikes."

Besides, if the initial attack did provoke an AoO, it would mention it, like it does in the Disarm entry and the Grapple entry.

 

[Caliban]

Haw haw!!!1 Caliban wants the last word by saying that he doesn't want the last word!!11!!!

You do realize that stops being funny after the 3rd or 4th time, right?

 

[dcollins]

In fact, I'll assert that you cannot find any statement in any weapon description -- other than this one you're identifying -- which holds true for all weapons in general and by default.

"I can use this weapon to hit someone for damage."
How's that?

Please cite which weapon description in the PH that is being quoted from, if you'd be so kind.

I'm not seeing it. The trip itself doesn't provoke an AoO, yes. Making an unarmed touch attack to _initiate_ the trip still counts as an unarmed attack, and that should still provoke an AoO (unless you have Improved Unarmed Strike).

This has been hashed out in many previous threads. The section of the PH that specifies AOOs for unarmed attacks is very specific to "Unarmed Strikes"... there is no language that specifies AOOs for unarmed attacks in general. Hence the need for each separate section on bull rushes, grapples, disarms, etc. to indicate the event of an AOO.

 

[Coredump]

Exactly. And therefore, if I have Weapon Focus with a staff, I get +1 on my attack roll with tripping with

Except now you are trying to get a mechanical advantage from a color description. From what you are saying, a thief could use a +5 greatsword to get a +5 on his open locks skill. It doesn't say he can't use a GS to open a lock.
Or try this, I have a fighter with a +5 dart, and weapon focus, so do I get +6 to trip if I am holding a dart??

The trip action itself doesn't provoke an AoO, but making an unarmed attack surely would.

Making the initial touch attack, if unarmed, should provoke an AoO, shouldn't it?

Um, why do you say this? I haven't been able to find this in the rules....
On page 140 it talks about getting an AoO, but *specifically* mentions "striking for damage".

Now, moving into the threatened (5') area would garner an AoO, but I don't see where it says the trip would.

Further, it is done as a melee touch attack, and the description of a MTA doesn't mention getting an AoO either.

.

 

[hong]

Please cite which weapon description in the PH that is being quoted from, if you'd be so kind.

Exactly. I can't, and yet the intention is clearly understood. Just as it should be clear that any weapon can be used with a trip.

This has been hashed out in many previous threads. The section of the PH that specifies AOOs for unarmed attacks is very specific to "Unarmed Strikes"... there is no language that specifies AOOs for unarmed attacks in general.

"Attacking unarmed provokes an AoO from the character you attack" -- PHB, p.140

Hence the need for each separate section on bull rushes, grapples, disarms, etc. to indicate the event of an AOO.

This is because when you make bull rushes, grapples, disarms etc with a weapon, you _still_ provoke an AoO. This isn't the case for a trip.