Turn Undead should be removed!

[mmadsen]

I never understood why turn undead wasn't simply another spell for clerics to cast -- or a side-effect of a spell like protection from evil.

 

[The Ubbergeek]

I never understood why turn undead wasn't simply another spell for clerics to cast -- or a side-effect of a spell like protection from evil.

It's more a power than a spell, but well...

 

[Jorunkun]

My main problem with turn undead is the way it's so hardwired into the class concept of the cleric and the game system at large.

If you want to run a campaign which plays around with the nature and powers of undead - i.e. take them out completely, make them rare and really scary, or to use them as the main enemies constantly - you have a lot of tweaking to do to keep the system balanced.

I hope changing this will be easier in 4e.

 

[Nathan P. Mahney]

Turn undead was a necessity in earlier editions of the game, simply because undead all had abilities that were really nasty - aging, death effects, and especially energy drain. With energy drain nerfed for 3e but turning remaining about the same in power, undead were significantly lessened as a threat. From a DM's perspective, I'd love to see the balance shifted back the other way for 4e.

 

[Cadfan]

Turning undead should have been a spell from the start. There's no excuse for it not having been.

D&D Design Sin Number 47: Creating a new power/resource mechanic for a class that already has one that could have done the job. See the Elocater for reference. The class already has power points. It gains Psionic Teleport and Psionic Plane Shift as bonus powers. But it gains Psionic Dimensional Door as a once per day ability? Why, I ask you, why?!?

 

[the_myth]

There was an episode of Dr Who (5th doctor? 6th doctor?) set in WW2 where the village priest couldn't hold off the undead because he'd lost his faith due to the horrors of war.

Later in that episode a Russian soldier actually succeeded in turning undead using a hammer and sickle emblem, because of his faith in the Communist Party.

Some of the posters on this forum might be able to achieve the same result by brandishing the 4th edition players handbook

7th actually (Sylvester McCoy), and the episode was "The Curse of Fenric."

A bit hokey but fun.

And you missed mentioning how Ace, the Doctor's teen companion, held the big kahuna vampire at bay with her faith in the Doctor.

And earlier on in the episode, the Doctor himself sent a flock of vamps screaming by expressing his faith in his former companions.

 

[Incenjucar]

Thing with 4th edition is that Radiant energy... ...would be from the Feywild.

The power that smears undead comes from the land of pixies and elves and whatnot.

Especially now that being undead only occasionally means a soul hasn't gone on to its proper place...

Turning Undead is kind of left field now.

 

[Klaus]

Turning undead should have been a spell from the start. There's no excuse for it not having been.

D&D Design Sin Number 47: Creating a new power/resource mechanic for a class that already has one that could have done the job. See the Elocater for reference. The class already has power points. It gains Psionic Teleport and Psionic Plane Shift as bonus powers. But it gains Psionic Dimensional Door as a once per day ability? Why, I ask you, why?!?

I'll see your Elocator and raise you an Arcane Trickster. Why create a x/day Ranged Legerdemain instead of allowing an Arcane Trickster to Open Locks, Pick Pockets and Disarm Traps through the use of Mage Hand? At higher levels they might even be allowed to create mage hands with thieves' tools incorporated.

 

[Sitara]

They should have called it bigby's thieving hand or something.

Heckthere should have been a bigby hand/fist spell forevery level...including bigby's middle finger to show to monsters you are running away from! ;P

Ok then, carry on.

 

[Klaus]

They should have called it bigby's thieving hand or something.

Heckthere should have been a bigby hand/fist spell forevery level...including bigby's middle finger to show to monsters you are running away from! ;P

Ok then, carry on.

FYI, there *are* Bigby spells for every level. Ditto on Tenser, Otiluke and the rest of the original Circle of Eight. They just weren't all converted to 3e.