Twenty plus one

[pukunui]

I just find him bland, about the only thing he has going for him is that he does hate the undead so much.

I would like him better if he were more 'holier than thou old school medieval Christian.' Heck, I love St. Cuthbert. Who actually is a holier than thou old school medieval Christian.

Yes, that's true. I forgot about him. He's even named after a real holier-than-thou old school medieval Christian! Take that, Pelor!

So as I see it, the result they've arrived at is a response to an extension of the belief that NPC's and PC's should operate according to the same set of rules. The Designers have been very clear that NPC's and PC's do not operate according to the same set of rules. So, what I'm wondering about is why it seems like in this one specific (and unimportant instance) they appear to have caved.

I can't read the game designers' thoughts so I don't know if you're right or not. All I know is that they have created a "back to basics" style of pantheon, where every deity that appears in the PHB will have some appeal to an adventuring cleric. If the DM and/or the players want to have deities of things that don't inspire adventuring, then they can add them in themselves ... they simply don't need to be in the PHB.

Don't get me wrong though. I'm not actually upset about this or even care all that much. It's just something I noticed that I thought was odd.

I don't find it odd at all.

Ehh. I agree that the 3E pantheon wasn't realistic. But, it also didn't go to the same lengths to make every god relevant to adventurers.

Sure it did. Every deity listed in the 3.5 PHB is a deity whose clerics will have reason to go adventuring. The Greyhawk deities of things like doorways and agriculture aren't in the PHB. They can only be found in either the LGG or Complete Divine. I think you might find, therefore, that some of the campaign settings will still have these "non-adventuring cleric producing" deities in their pantheons, but the core pantheon, which is what appears in the PHB, will not ... and it's really not anything new at all.

Also, I'm sure it seems like the Sun and Farming go together, but I'm not sure that from a historical sense they typically did. I know that in Greek Mythology Demeter was the goddess of agriculture and Apollo was the Sun. Not sure about the others though.

True. Demeter was also the goddess of fertility, the life cycle, and a bunch of other things. Apollo was also the god of archery, arts & culture, etc etc. Real world pantheistic deities tend to be very complicated creatures. It's probably for the better that d&d deities don't match their real world counterparts too closely ... or else, once again, no one will want to play a cleric.

Anyhow, it doesn't really matter since no one pays any attention to religious stuff anyway.

Aww, be fair. Some people do.

 

[Gort]

There needs to be a Tymora-like god(dess) of good fortune. Maybe that'll be tacked onto Avandra's portfolio?

Oh great, another god of rerolls.

I kinda think "luck" shouldn't be a part of a single gods portfolio, rather aspects of luck being part of every gods portfolio. Like you might pray to Crom to be lucky in battle, or to Odin to be lucky and get good questions on tomorrows maths test.

 

[helium3]

Seeking a middle ground?

Appeasing as many people as possible?

Avoiding conversations like the one above where the player is like "Why CAN'T I be a cleric of agriculture?" and the DM is like "Because it's boring to me!"

Because some people seriously care?



Wrong. You now owe me a cookie for posting a lie. I demand it be chocolate chip. E-mail me, and I'll tell you where to deliver it.

Sure. PM me your mailing address and I'll get right on that.

I have a killer recipe for big soft ginger cookies that I like a lot more though . . .

And really, the only reason I'm taking the implied "no one cares about that but clomping nerds" position is that lately it seems to be the favored method for dismissing complaints/concerns about 4E tidbits. *shrug*

 

[hong]

Ehh. I agree that the 3E pantheon wasn't realistic. But, it also didn't go to the same lengths to make every god relevant to adventurers.

Look at it this way. The gods did not make themselves relevant to adventurers. The adventurers made the gods relevant to them.